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Thread: Close to Final Rendering - Need Eyes!!

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
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    12

    Close to Final Rendering - Need Eyes!!

    So I'm getting close to prepping for final rendering - reinforce shadows, add reflective light, add hue of light sources to all objects, etc. - and I need some eyes for suggestions, tips and tricks. This will be my first attempt at final rendering in ArtRage. I've used Sketchbook Pro exclusively to this point.

    I'm learning about the layer and tool blend features, and so maybe some helpful tricks of the trade for making those last light effects pop would be helpful.

    Also, if anything is wrong to your eyes let me know. I've been staring at this for over 3-weeks now so, I may be missing some major uh-ohs.

    Thanks in advance!!

    --Kai

    Oh, the canvas is set at 18 x 24 at 300 dpi so the pixelation from the noise filter shown in the JPEG below is not visible in the actual PNG true to size file that will be used for printing.

    Name:  Frankie WIP JPEG.jpg
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  2. #2
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    937
    Hello Kai and welcome to the AR forums
    As you have specifically asked for comments from the perspective of other eyes I would venture some here for your consideration:
    1: Values
    2: Tangents/FlowLines
    3: Margins

    1: Actually overall the values are pretty good but where they, to my eyes, start to fall down is from her right hip going down to her pet "dog". The values are mostly the same causing the leg to merge somewhat with the pet and the pet into the path. Looking at this area in B&W really helps see it.
    (Ive taken the liberty of attaching a B&W version here. I hope you don't mind.)
    Suggestion: Make sure you define form and depth through values not with colour. As I say you've nailed this in most of the rest of the picture.
    While working in AR specifically, if you have a layer at the top of the layer stack that is flood filled with 100% black, opacity 100% and set blend mode to Colour you can toggle this On/Off as you work to help check Values.
    (Note; in other software like Photoshop for example using Saturation is a more usual blend mode choice but for some reason Colour blend mode seems to give a more accurate value representation in AR4.)

    2: The Tangent/Flow that bothers me is the way the right leg goes strait into the middle of the pets head and looks part of it. Additionally the dog's right leg is perfectly in line with her right leg, this forms a strong sight line running from the dog's paw right through to her hip. My brain knows they are separate objects but my eyes keep thinking otherwise.
    Suggestions: Correcting the values will help a lot here but consider showing something of her lower leg and/or foot. Just so we are sure she has a lower leg! If the dog were nudged slightly say to our left this would also help break the line of her leg with the dog's front leg.

    3: As you say this is intended for print I would try and give yourself more room around the edges for cropping/bleeds. She's already lost her left fingers it seems a shame to possibly risk loosing her toes and the foremost pumpkin part of an eye!
    It is always tempting to use all the canvas available and I have done it myself! Now if something is for print I have a low opacity Margins Layer on the very top of the layer stack I can toggle On/Off so I know when I'm straying into the "danger zone".

    I offer the above purely as observations from my perspective and I hope you take them in the spirit they are intended.
    I do look forward to seeing more of your work here and once again welcome to the AR community.
    Name:  Frankie WIP JPEG.jpg
Views: 294
Size:  115.6 KB
    Maker Of Replica Macoys

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  3. #3
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
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    12
    Marlow,

    Thank you!!! Thank you!! Thank you!! That's exactly what I've was looking for.

    Below I've added some comments now that I've looked at it as you were saying. I'm going to start developing that area's values and hopefully rearrange some stuff but here's my thoughts so far.Name:  Frankie WIP wMarlow Comments.jpg
Views: 293
Size:  102.8 KB

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    937
    So relived you found my thoughts helpful!
    I would never wish to just undermine another's work.

    And I see you are now considering other changes too!
    I would say her overall posture didn't bother me and has I think a nice dynamic tension to it. But I do see what you're thinking now…
    Sadly I'm rather tied up now for a while but will try and look in here when I can to see how this turns out.
    But this is a friendly forum here and others are always willing to help where they can. You need but ask

    Just noticed your little gallery page here in the forums too. You definitely have a look to your work, I like it
    Maker Of Replica Macoys

    Techie Stuff:
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  5. #5
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
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    300
    Quote Originally Posted by Kailestel View Post
    Marlow,

    Thank you!!! Thank you!! Thank you!! That's exactly what I've was looking for.

    Below I've added some comments now that I've looked at it as you were saying. I'm going to start developing that area's values and hopefully rearrange some stuff but here's my thoughts so far.

    Some more feedback I hope you might find useful:


    Look at the dog as it is now.

    Imagine isolating the dog from the rest of the picture and try to imagine from scratch the angle of the surface/ground on which it is sitting. How would it recede into the frame? i.e. what is the angle that surface makes in relation to the frame?
    To my eyes, the dogs feet and rump are almost all aligned along the horizontal, something to expect if the camera were low, and its viewing angle toward the dog essentially parallel with the surface on which the dog is sitting.

    Now consider the actual scene. It is clear that from the camera position, one is looking downwards towards the ground where the dog is sitting.

    Suggestions:

    1. Rework the dog so that it is integrated with the ground and the camera is looking down on it... its paws and rump would form a triangle, like a tripod seen from that angle OR
    2. Keep the dog and rework the foreground part of the scene (on which the dog and woman sit/stand) so that it looks more like the camera is closer to the ground, and is more integrated with the posture of the dog

    Hope this helps.


    Would you mind if I showed you what I mean (using a warp brush)?
    Last edited by DarkOwnt; 10-09-2015 at 01:11 AM.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Posts
    12
    DarkOwnt,

    Yes please!! Sorry it took me a while to reply, I was super busy at work yesterday and didn't get to work on my drawings at all or check the forums. Any tips you can give I would greatly appreciate!!

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
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    300
    Quote Originally Posted by Kailestel View Post
    DarkOwnt,

    Yes please!! Sorry it took me a while to reply, I was super busy at work yesterday and didn't get to work on my drawings at all or check the forums. Any tips you can give I would greatly appreciate!!

    This is a very rough blurry attempt at what I mean. Warping has its limits, I would tweak it even more to get the perspective correct.

    Name:  WarpedDog2.jpg
Views: 264
Size:  120.3 KB

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Posts
    12
    I see what you mean!! I will definitely give it a shot. I haven't gotten to Watzit yet, as when I was working on Frankie I noticed some major anatomical errors even for comic book style.

    Here's my attempt at value shading (very rough) no blending yet.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Frankie Value.jpg 
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ID:	87834

    Sorry if its a little NSFW. Also, I'm thinking I might be at the point where structured art classes might be beneficial rather than youtube videos...

    So after a day's worth of work....

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	To be Blended1.jpg 
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ID:	87840
    Last edited by Kailestel; 10-14-2015 at 09:11 AM.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Posts
    12

    And its done

    So that one took me longer than I expected. About 80 hrs into that piece.

    Thank you all for the feed back. Really helped me look at my piece in a different angle.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	A Ghoul and Her Dog JPEG.jpg 
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ID:	87860

    Full resolution at my deviantart page, luvablepriestess.deviantart.com

    Reference Images Used:
    Name:  Profile_art_-_SO_Frankie_explanation.jpg
Views: 630
Size:  87.0 KBName:  Profile_art_-_Watzit.jpg
Views: 234
Size:  45.0 KB
    Last edited by Kailestel; 10-15-2015 at 06:03 PM.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    937
    Wow, this has all turned out rather well I see.
    Love the out of focus leaf in the foreground, nice touch that in an area that might have been a bit "dead" (bad pun) otherwise in this composition.
    Great work, looking forward to seeing more from you
    Last edited by markw; 10-17-2015 at 07:40 AM.
    Maker Of Replica Macoys

    Techie Stuff:
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