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Thread: ArtRage 64-bit

  1. #1
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    ArtRage 64-bit

    Are there any plans to make ArtRage into a 64-bit program? It would increase the speed of ArtRage with the ability to use more then 2gb of ram and more information during each cycle (64 bit word verses 32 bit word during a cycle a second).
    Also, I use SAVE a lot. This is a habit of mine. I have one key programed on my wacom tablet to save. I'm not much a believer in the auto-save because that always seems to happen during the wrong time. Every time I hit save (Command-S), it takes for ever for ArtRage to save. Is there any way to speed up the save command?
    The past is history, the future is a mystery, all you have is the present

  2. #2
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    64 bit is something we're looking at, however I don't have a time estimate for that, as it requires a fairly significant rewrite of the application.

    Regarding auto-save, ArtRage doesn't have auto-save as saving a large file wouldbe too disruptive to workflow, so I'm unsure what feature you're referring to there. Unlike many other applications which only deal with colour, ArtRage also tracks other media properties such as wetness, media thickness and so on which will tend to increase file size. The speed of saving will depend on the speed of the system and storage media and the size of the file, there's no way to speed it up inside the application. I hope this helps!
    Dave
    Resident Bug-Hunter
    Ambient Design

  3. #3
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    I'm sure you've answered this many times before, but I can't remember the answer-- how would going 64bit help Artrage specfically? I remember that you've often said brush performance is really all about cpu power in Artrage, not ram like in Photoshop, but I also know that Artrage can really lag on large canvases (6000 x 6000 or so) compared to other programs, with, say, Transformations, Zooming, Saving, etc. Are these the sorts of things that would benefit from the access to more ram? Are there other things too?

    Eventually, I'll be buying a new laptop. It'd be nice to understand what access to more ram would do once/if a 64bit version of Artrage comes out.
    Check out and submit to the thread on Watercolor WIPs in Artrage-- lots of good tips and conversation
    My YouTube video tutorial series- How to Paint with Watercolors in Artrage
    Try out the free
    Artrage Pen-Only Toolbar to improve your workflow and reduce clutter
    List of other good tutorials on using watercolors in Artrage
    List of good sticker sprays for watercolor effects in Artrage

    My blog- art, poetry and picture books- http://www.seamlessexpression.blogspot.com/

  4. #4
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    Thank you DaveRage.
    Steve B - I'll try and explain bit variations and ram as I see it. In the old days, first computers, they were 8 bit and very slow - i.e. 64 and 128 kilo hertz (kilo cycles) per second- which means for example - 1 cycle per second with an 8 bit word happens, of course, every second. One kilo cycle (1 cycle times 1000) happens every second. Thus, 64 kilo Hz (cycles) equals 1 cycle times 64,000 eight bit words every second. A mega hz is 1 kilo cycle times 1000. That's 1,000,000 cycles a second with an 8 bit word. And now we are dealing with Giga hz = 1 mega hz times 1000 every second. Pretty amazing. But we also now have 32 bit systems and software and 64 bit systems and software. Instead of just an 8 bit word each cycle, for an 32 bit system, we have four 8 bit words per second and of course we can have eight 8 bit words per second for the 64 bit systems and software. That's a lot of information. Then when you crank up the speed to 3 Giga hz operating on a 64 bit operating system, the old 64 kilo hz Commadore machine now looks very slow. I can remember the days.
    As for RAM, each time you type a letter, move your mouse, or draw with your pen on your wacom tablet, the computer has to execute your command and immediately goes to your hard drive for the imformation. Now your hard drive is not that fast (some are faster then others - rpm speed). So they have what is called Ram. Ram is static and operates delivering the information for the commands a whole lot faster (there are different speeds of Ram). Depending on the amount of Ram and the operating system/software, will determine the speed of the retrieval of the information after the command is sent. A larger ram means quicker retrieval of information. Less ram means the computer will have to use both the ram and the hard drive, which slows information down. 32 bit systems/software can only use 2 Giga hz of ram, while 64 can use everything you computer has loaded on it. Of course there the L1 and L2 caches - smaller but real static type of ram. I won't get into those.
    Hope this explains everything.
    The past is history, the future is a mystery, all you have is the present

  5. #5
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    GRSarts,
    I have to admit that although that didn't answer the question I intended to aski (obviously I didn't make myself clear), it was a very interesting read indeed!

    My question is more program specific--

    For example, being 64bit matters a lot for a program like PS because brush speed and performance is tied to ram. People often talk of it as a ram "hog". More ram improves it's performance dramatically. Thus, being 64bit is a __really__ big deal for PS users.

    Comparatively, from previous conversations here with the Artrage guys, it seems that the brush engine in Artrage is more directly tied to cpu performance and not to ram. Thus, most likely why they concentrated their efforts first on going multi-core and not on going 64bit. As such, I wondered what the real world, program-specific benefits of going 64bit would be for Artrage, as it seems it would be different from other programs.
    Check out and submit to the thread on Watercolor WIPs in Artrage-- lots of good tips and conversation
    My YouTube video tutorial series- How to Paint with Watercolors in Artrage
    Try out the free
    Artrage Pen-Only Toolbar to improve your workflow and reduce clutter
    List of other good tutorials on using watercolors in Artrage
    List of good sticker sprays for watercolor effects in Artrage

    My blog- art, poetry and picture books- http://www.seamlessexpression.blogspot.com/

  6. #6
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    Steve B - That's correct regarding speed. 64 bit would mainly affect file size due to being able to access more RAM, but will probably not have a significant impact on speed.
    Dave
    Resident Bug-Hunter
    Ambient Design

  7. #7
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    Steve B, Sorry I didn't hit the point. Ram is still important, but yes the processor(s) are more important. It's because the processors process your commands and the software code. The faster they are, the faster things get done. On the other hand, the hard drive, ram, and cache are storage units. And the faster they spit out their information for the processor to execute your commands, the faster things get done.
    Having said that, I believe there comes a point now that the speed you realize from some of these processors may not be worth the extra money they cost. And then, how much Ram do you really need? If you have 4 giga bits of Ram - isn't that enough to load your whole program into Ram plus more? It wasn't that long ago that 512 kb of Ram was adequate.
    As for Photoshop using Ram, all software, it would seem, is written to use Ram. Now though, it is also written in 32 bit or 64 bit language. And 64 bit can take advantage of more Ram.
    With the new processors using multiple cores, most software is not being developed that can really use the advantages of multiple cores.
    All of these new innovations take a lot of code rewriting (work) as DaveRage said. Which translates into cost.
    The past is history, the future is a mystery, all you have is the present

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