ArtRage 5 Product PageArtRage Lite Product PageArtRage for iPad Product PageArtRage for Android Product PageArtRage  Android Oil Painter Free Product PageArtRage  Free Demos Page

Page 1 of 4 123 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 32

Thread: Palette Knife Again

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    15

    Palette Knife Again

    OK,
    I'll post this again after like one year.
    Why is Artrage obviously recognizing tilt with the Intuos4 (when I hover over the canvas the palette knife rotation reacts to the pen tilt)

    But as soon as I press down and paint, it is ignored.

    Since it's almost there, It must take like half an hour to fix this (Yes, I know what I'm talking about, I know programming).

    I don't see any reaction to user suggestions here. So you worked on the shiny new iPad app, but I'm losing confidence in the product I purchased. I don't like to see almost perfect software to be abandoned.
    I don't own an iPad, but when I do, I'll be reluctant to purchase or recommend the app, considering the development of Artrage.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    New Zealand
    Posts
    3,134
    The knife doesn't react to tilt at all, including before mouse down, if you're seeing the orientation change before mouse down it's purely due to movement direction (when you tilt the stylus, you're probably moving the tip slightly which is causing a direction shift).

    Implementing tilt in the palette knife is certainly not a half hour job. While getting tilt data itself may be easy (we do use it for spray tools like the airbrush) applying it to the rendered path of the smear function isn't just a matter of flicking a switch. There's also the question of what tilting a flat bladed knife actually does on a canvas and how that interacts with the simulation.

    We do read and make a note of all of the suggestions that get posted, but we don't reply to all of them directly.

    As for the product being abandoned, I think the beta testers currently working on 3.0.8 would probably disagree. There are updates coming, we have spent a few months improving our general tools and development environment, but there is a series of fixes and improvements on the way with more to come after.
    Matt
    ArtRage UI
    Ambient Design.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    15
    Hi Matt,

    Call me crazy, but the palette knife _does_ react to tilt.
    I'm going to make video later today, to prove it.

    I'm still using Painter and it's palette knife because tilt works there.
    I want to be able to smear with the edge only, by tilting the pen.
    You can easily go from flat to edge that way, without changing tools.
    That's how it is with a real palette knife, by the way.
    I don't see how it is useful right now. The great thing about a palette knife is that it allows to define/follow a contour with the edge, and then to pulling it perpendicular to it.
    Last edited by plastic; 10-13-2010 at 10:10 PM.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    15
    Here is a video to proof that pen tilt is correctly tracked in Artrage, as long as the pen is hovering. As soon as pressed down to paint, tilt orientation is ignored for flow direction:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eV6PCozfMBs

    Here is a video of using palette knife with Corel Painter, pen tilt is correctly tracked here. It's possible to drag it on the edge, or flat, depending on pen tilt.
    I'd wish to be able to do this with Artrage´s superiour paint engine:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lTFsKy4fCfg

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    NC, USA
    Posts
    2,867
    Quote Originally Posted by plastic View Post
    Hi Matt,

    Call me crazy, but the palette knife _does_ react to tilt.
    I'm going to make video later today, to prove it.
    My Wacom Graphire 4 drawing tablet doesn't have tilt capabilities and I can replicate the effects seen in your video of ArtRage. It's the swinging of your pens tip, while tilting the pen, that is causing the changes you are seeing onscreen, rather then the tilting of the pen itself.
    Nothing is easy to the unwilling.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    15
    Quote Originally Posted by Someonesane View Post
    My Wacom Graphire 4 drawing tablet doesn't have tilt capabilities and I can replicate the effects seen in your video of ArtRage. It's the swinging of your pens tip, while tilting the pen, that is causing the changes you are seeing onscreen, rather then the tilting of the pen itself.
    I#m sorry but it's not...you can't replicate the same with a Graphire tablet.
    It's more clear in the Painter video...changing the angle of the Palette Knife while drawing. The angle is parallel to the physical pen orientation.

    While hovering, it's the same with Artrage.
    It works with the Intus tablet. The Bamboo and Graphire tablets always follow the drawing flow perpendicular, because they can't "see" the pen orientation.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    NC, USA
    Posts
    2,867
    Ah, I see it now. Interesting... Does it have a similar reaction on tools like the Paint Tube, Glitter, or Crayon (as I assume none of those tools are supposed to sense tilt either)?

    I recall the AR team mentioning something about the requirements needed for their methods in rendering brush strokes limiting their abilities to use tilt with certain tools. I'm sure if it were a simple fix, they'd have thrown it in a long time ago. They're really good about adding in the features that people ask for (nearly everything added in ArtRage 3 seems to be additions based on user feedback).
    Nothing is easy to the unwilling.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Sofia, Bulgaria
    Posts
    184
    Quote Originally Posted by plastic View Post
    I#m sorry but it's not...you can't replicate the same with a Graphire tablet.
    It's more clear in the Painter video...changing the angle of the Palette Knife while drawing. The angle is parallel to the physical pen orientation.

    While hovering, it's the same with Artrage.
    It works with the Intus tablet. The Bamboo and Graphire tablets always follow the drawing flow perpendicular, because they can't "see" the pen orientation.
    I'm using Bamboo, and when hovering the pen over the tablet in Artrage - brushes follow the tip of the pen, even very slight movement changes the direction. So it looks the same as in your Artrage video. In Corel Painter it's totally different - as Bamboo doesn't have tilt, palette knife doesn't rotate. It does with my Intuos 3 at work.
    "I'm a fuel injected suicide machine. I am the rocker, I am the roller, I am the out-of-controller!"
    __________________
    www.borilius.com

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    15
    Quote Originally Posted by Borilius View Post
    I'm using Bamboo, and when hovering the pen over the tablet in Artrage - brushes follow the tip of the pen, even very slight movement changes the direction. So it looks the same as in your Artrage video. In Corel Painter it's totally different - as Bamboo doesn't have tilt, palette knife doesn't rotate. It does with my Intuos 3 at work.
    Please look again carefully...when hovering, the brush shape doesn't follow the flow, it follows pen tilt. At one point I'm almost still, fixed position, but rotating the pen around this point. The brush shape follows that movement. This only works with Intuos tablets. But as soon as you press down to paint with Artrage, the orientation is gone. That's what I'm mourning.
    It's hard to demonstrate, you have to try it yourself to see it.
    I have both Intuos and Bamboo, so I know that there is a difference.
    Tilt is a great way to control the shape direction while painting. In Photoshop and Painter this works perfectly. But unfortunately both suck for everything else, regarding painting.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    New Zealand
    Posts
    3,134
    Tilt is not processed in the palette knife before or after mouse down, what you are seeing is the result of slight movements of the pen nib. There is no code at all to process tilt in the palette knife.

    Tilt in the palette knife is on our list of things to consider when we do updates, but I don't have any estimate as to when it might go in.
    Matt
    ArtRage UI
    Ambient Design.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •