View Full Version : my problems with felt pen

05-16-2006, 06:06 AM
could somebody explain me what happened with the white felt pen?
It become a wonderful smudge tool with 100% wetness, but it losed every color information it had formerly.
No matter how much is the pressure or softness it works not like a white but as a transparent pen.
I really-really love the smudge ability of it but I really-really miss a clean white "brush".
if I remember right -in AR 2.05- I could paint pure white with felt pen on a separate layer.
What's supposed to replace this ability in this or future releases?
Is the "superbrush" (simple round brush) on your "to do" list? that would help. :)

Dear (fantastic supporter) developers: please give me an answer!
thank you

05-16-2006, 09:08 AM
The white felt-pen went through a major re-write between 2.05 and 2.11
The way it was previously working was less realistic (we felt) than it is now. The white was a sort of cheating way to do the colour-washes. I think what we have now is closer to the real way a wet marker would work than the previous way it was.

There will definitely be things in upcoming releases that will give similar results. We *do* listen to our users!

I'm not sure what you're asking about the 'superbrush'. Can you explain what you mean?

05-16-2006, 09:47 AM
i spent a couple years in tech school doing nothing but marker rendering, and i must agree that the way the "clear" (or "white") marker works now is most realistic. i like it, cause when i'm doing a quick marker rendering, i know how its going to react and work. and i really like not having to dig out my whole big box of $5-a-piece markers and special paper just to do a doodle!

05-16-2006, 12:51 PM
thanks for the quick reply

It's not a question of realism for me. I do feel the new felt pen much more realistic too.
Not this is my problem. I just miss a regular round brush with variable loading and softness values - maybe with 2 switch for pressure sensitivity (size and opacity) and without the (otherwise cool) volume or thickness. But this brush would blend colors exactly the same way as the oil brush and paint roller do now.
Somehow like the acrylic brushes work in Painter. But this is the only thing I like in that monstre sw... I hate everything else in it. I love AR and I would like to do all my illustration and concept work in it.
But I would need this clear, simple brush. And I know, that I'm not the 1st who asked this. I seriously think that this feature in AR would build a much larger user base and community.
And I called it "superbrush" just because it's nonexistent in reality not as the other tools in AR. It's too good like superman. :)

05-16-2006, 05:35 PM
Matt and I are often in discussion about the value of adding 'digital' tools to ArtRage.
They'd be massively useful for digital artists, but there's a big risk of 'breaking' ArtRage.

And we're not trying to be everything to eveyone. If Painter has a tool which does a better job than ArtRage, you can always use Painter for that tool!

This is one of the reasons why we're curious about what 'ArtRage Pro' would have, if it existed. More 'digital' type tools is probably what a pro would expect to find.

05-16-2006, 06:18 PM
Matt and I are often in discussion about the value of adding 'digital' tools to ArtRage.
They'd be massively useful for digital artists, but there's a big risk of 'breaking' ArtRage.

This is one of the reasons why we're curious about what 'ArtRage Pro' would have, if it existed. More 'digital' type tools is probably what a pro would expect to find.

My preference is definately to have ArtRage refined but kept simple. For me the only things really missing at the moment are watercolor, along with washy blending, and true pigment color mixing. I have Photoshop for digital stuff, I would rather time were spent on optimizing the speed of layer function and large brushes, and adding traditional tools.

05-16-2006, 11:57 PM
Maybe you are right. I don't know. I don't want to convince you about anything.
By the way I'm not a fan of the ArtRage Pro idea. For example I would miss the cutout, copy-paste, stright line, ruler, etc. functions from a software like Photoshop. But not from ArtRage! I love that I'm forced to pay attention to composition like with a piece of paper. I learn a lot from this. So I do not want million different type of digital tools.
I can do now nearly everything with ArtRage. One allround digital brush just would make this much simpler in many case (needless tricks with 2-3 other tools combination).
And I think you would make the best digital brush I have ever seen. :)

PS: it's not an idea or anything, I just imagined an Artrage utopia (with a big smile on my face), where is a big button in the top left corner and when you push it, the whole UI turns inside out & upside down with a thrilling animation and became a futuristic digital interface with just digital tools.
hehe... funny me. I would switch off that animation in no time :)

05-17-2006, 01:53 AM
What's the natural media equivalent to a "Multiply layering method"? Gel medium or something?


05-17-2006, 02:12 AM
It's strange... but I feel not I'm the one, who want to force his will on you. :)

05-17-2006, 04:05 AM
knyu- I hope you didn't feel that I was angry or making my comments personal. I just wanted to give voice to the topic from my perspective. Please continue to express your views as well. The beautiful thing about this forum and the company behind it is that they listen to people and offer feedback. This is *not* a common experience for software at this level of quality. It is important that they hear from all who care for this magic tool. I hope to hear more from you and to continue to see your art on this forum.

05-17-2006, 10:49 AM
In terms of layer blend 'modes', such as subtract, lighten, darken, multiply, and so on....
The default way most paint applications composite one layer on top of another layer is very un-natural. It's a sort of linear colour interpolation - a very digital process. Semi-transparent paint uses a more subtractive process when layered.
ArtRage uses the standard way everyone else does layer compositing by default. This is why marker-pens on a layer above the base layer dont seem to look quite 'right' overtop of paint on the base layer. They look like they're digital paint.
In a future release of ArtRage we're likely to offer layer blend modes. The most important ones for traditional artists are multiply and subtract - modes that more closely reflect the actual way real semi-transparent layered paints would appear.