View Full Version : 30 min. From Reference on Over sized canvas.

03-26-2006, 01:39 PM
Hey Ragers,

I did this in about 30 minutes on a 2000 x 1400 canvas I made by scanning burlap and letting a semi-transparent layer become "gesso". I started with a 5000 x 3500 canvas but that sort of made things sluggish on my system (P4 2.4 Ghz, 1Gb RAM).

I do have to say I found myself wishing for a nice badger hair blending brush.
Still I had fun.


03-26-2006, 02:33 PM
Wow! Fantastic!
30 minutes? Man, that's phenomenal. The colours and expression and detail, and, well everything!

I had to show MattRage that one. He wants to steal your paper.


Aged P
03-26-2006, 08:41 PM
Simply Beautiful!!!
It has passed the "print it out and pin it up" test. Along with the Monet Water Lily and Sweedie's pencil sketch.

Spell out the bit about the semi opaque gesso layer for me.
I'm making paper while awaiting my Intuos.
Is there a future for some sort of Paper Interchange Area?

I can see problems with it because, like Fashmir's, the Elf in my computer really has to pedal hard to cope with large exotic papers.

It would take a lot space and speed, and might need a separate web site.

03-26-2006, 09:11 PM
I'm making paper while awaiting my Intuos.
Is there a future for some sort of Paper Interchange Area?

I can see problems with it because, like Fashmir's, the Elf in my computer really has to pedal hard to cope with large exotic papers.

It would take a lot space and speed, and might need a separate web site.

Y'know, we're thinking about it. It would be nice to have a way to share assets for ArtRage. At the moment the only real assets are custom papers, custom colour pickers, swatch sets, although there are liable to be more things with future versions. At the moment you're welcome to use the gallery for that kinda thing. We'll shout if our bandwidth vanishes too fast.

03-27-2006, 06:53 AM
A gift,

Here is a link to the blank canvas in Art Rage format. It is about 23.5Mb it has the "gesso" layer and a blank layer to paint on as well as the underlying burlap and the grain.

www.vismag.com/Art Rage/Large Canvas 2000 x 1400.ptg

If the link is not clickable just copy and paste it into your brower address bar.

Be Well,


Aged P
03-27-2006, 07:24 AM
Hi, Fashmir

Thanks a lot!

My computer is about the same as yours, this canvas stretches it to it's limits but it's worth it. Sudden dramatic moves mean that the paint tends to be a little slow reacting, well a full 4 inches behind the Mouse at times!

I've stashed it away under various file names so that I don't overpaint it someday.

The canvas still shows texture when used with Tube paint and the Palette knife, I think this is going to make Impressionist stuff a lot easier.

I will go away and experiment with it now.
Thanks once again.

Aged P
03-27-2006, 08:11 AM
Hi Fashmir,

I'd like to check whether you've had this problem. Only because it occurred using the new canvas.

The Roller is capable,by design, of taking paint off the canvas as well as putting it on. but I was squidging merrily away with the Roller creating a Psychedelic Sunset, ample paint around straight out of the Tube, when this happened.

On every Roller setting, apart from all Zeros, the paint was stripped back to the canvas. The set of "paint free" tracks all seem the same, regardless of tool settings.

I doubt that it's canvas related, which would leave only two possibilities.
The nut at the back of the Mouse has failed again, or there is a Bug.

03-27-2006, 08:36 AM
Hi Aged-P

If you can reproduce the problem, can you drop a note to [email protected] - that will get to Dave who can put it in the buglist for us.

If you need to include the paper, so long as it's less that about 12MB you should be able to mail that as well.



03-27-2006, 09:47 AM
I haven't encountered this, but then I haven't tried exactly what you are doing. I have a thought or two though. First given that you are using a mouse and not a pressure sensitive tablet at the moment, it occurs to me that you are seeing this anomoly because of that. Did you set use mouse mode in the prefs? Next are you painting on a layer above the canvas? I assume you are as you have spoken of it in another post. If I can duplicate the anomoly I will report it.

Be well,


03-27-2006, 11:40 AM
30 mins, that's great- very interesting in the close up how well the canvas appears thru the paint too, that's so cool. that was great to include it so we could see. i've been only using the default basic paper texture this whole time- *runs off to scan stuff* :twisted:

03-27-2006, 08:29 PM
Sweet tricks Fashmir and thanks for sharing that gesso layer setup.

It's very intriguing and I've been looking for something like it.. for like forever.

I was wondering one thing. I usually paint on very large images sizes, and having three layers in that size will surely slow my computer to a halt. Is there any way you see it possible that one can apply the texture afterwards in some kind of overlay precedure.

I hope you understand what I'm trying to accomplish. Otherwise I'll see if I can explain it better.


03-27-2006, 08:43 PM
PVIllustration- I can envision putting the texture on after the fact in a few different ways that amount to about the same thing.
One you could do your painting work and map it to a plane in a 3D package and apply the grain image as a bump map. You could place a light in the scene and have quite a bit of control of how the textured grain showed up.

Two, you could take the finished painting into (drumroll please) Painter (fanfare of kazoos) and go to effects/surface control/apply surface texture. You would first have to establish the grain texture as a paper in painter.

Three you could take the finished painting and the grain texture into DarkTree (www.darksim.com) and using the painting as a color image and the grain as a bump image link them to the shader component and render it out at the same resolution as the painting.

The thing that will likely happen with these scenarios though, is that your paint stroke texture from Art Rage won't blend as naturaly with the grain texture as it would if you did it all in AR. If you are careful with your lighting controls in any of these methods you should be able to get close...

In theory.

Be well,


P.S. I almost forgot. You can reduce the afore mentioned three layers to two by simply merging the "gesso" layer onto the burlap and painting on the transparent layer above it. I only left the "gesso" layer unflattened as a means of teaching.

03-27-2006, 09:53 PM
thanks for the answer Fashmir.

I have tried almost all of those suggestions, and they really doesnt provide what I'm looking for.

There's one thing I've been wanting to try out lately which should give abit better result. By using the cloner tool in Painter you can apply the texture you want with new brushstrokes. It's certainly not perfect for what I'm really trying to do, but I guess it will have to do for now.

again, thanks for your suggestions.

03-27-2006, 09:58 PM
What's really required is for that damned lazy graphics-engine programmer at Ambient Design to get busy and write a decent memory management system for ArtRage documents.

It's a dark art in its own right. It's one of the things on my 'to do' list. It will be done at some point.


03-27-2006, 10:04 PM
haha, Andy... :D

Well, I'll be damned. Some great stuff I hear these days. First a new blending tool is on the way (;)!) and now this. oh my!

I'm actually on my way to the dentist, but even that can't keep that big smile away from my face!

05-30-2006, 01:56 PM
Wow Fashmir,
Absolutely breathtaking!
You not only mastered an oil on canvas, but a whole mood.

05-31-2006, 05:51 AM
im on that shore lookin at them go past!

no really.... i am!


06-02-2006, 07:52 PM
Very cool as alway uncle

06-03-2006, 02:12 AM
Look like a picture... very beautiful work!

06-03-2006, 03:43 AM
:) Hi Fashmir, I don't know about the technical side of your discussions but to do such work in only 30 minutes is breathtaking as is your painting.You produced such amazing works that one always receives a delight to the eyes.Fantastic piece of art work.Regards,Tony :shock: :)