View Full Version : Liquid White and Liquid Black

Aged P
04-28-2006, 07:54 AM
As close as I can get to the immutable laws of The Hairy One.

Many thanks to AndyRage for his technical expertise!

Save them in the same .PNG format, and then import them into ArtRage. they should give a very thin coat of black or white.

10 min Demo pic just shows potential. Far from finished.

04-28-2006, 08:59 AM
Wow - very cool picture!

Y'know, given how popular the 'wet on wet' painting is, it would be a no-brainer to add a setting to determine the depth of paint covering the canvas when you import an image. It's just that having too many settings around can be daunting for people who are first picking up the application.

I'll have a bit of a ponder.

Aged P
04-28-2006, 09:09 AM
Hi Andy,

I've never really grasped why the default is so thick.

I know that some painters like to use the paint in a sculpted way, but they usually initially apply it thickly with a brush. The brush marks are part of their painting.

Perhaps a Preferences file would fix it? Choose your own depth of paint.

05-03-2006, 09:18 AM
i don't think i understand this thread. what do the black and white png's do, exactly? is this like just making a layer of white paint and then trying to paint on it, and you get cool smudgy blending things happening?

Aged P
05-03-2006, 09:44 AM

If you just import a black or white picture to obtain a wet canvas the paint seems to be about 1/4 inch thick. Most tools carve deep channels into the surface.
These pics were prepared using some guidance from AndyRage and have a thin film of paint on them. If you import them, the paint slides and blends without forming ridges. It enables "Bob Ross" painting which is a form of traditional wet into wet oil painting.

05-03-2006, 09:53 AM
i grew up watching Bob, absolutely amazing how effortless he made it look!

i think i get it, but perhaps i'll have to download these and give them a shot to really get it.

05-03-2006, 11:05 AM
Yes, Bob Ross rules! I have endless amount of VHS tapes that I've taped from the TV and this is one reason I was excited about artrage so that the palette knife could imitate what he was doing.

However, even with wet on wet, when he applied a small amount of paint to the palette knife and pulled it, it did leave a bumpy kinda mark, based on the canvas surface and the paint was broken up as he pulled it. This is how he painted the mountains for example.

However, in AR if I apply a thin coat of paint, the palette knife will not leave "bumpy" marks as I pull over a think coated surface. It will just pull the paint beneath. I hope one day I could apply some paint to the palette knife also, just to try his techniques.

Also, the Bob White.png has some black blothces on the bottom left. Is that supposed to be there?

05-03-2006, 12:35 PM
It's just that having too many settings around can be daunting for people who are first picking up the application.
Daunting!? Oh, no no. Please, just stuff all the settings in there. We love tweaks and zillions of preference settings. Just add a menu item called "Don't Select Me", which will bring up the "Tons of Settings" dialog (...which would pop up the "Told You So" dialog for people who don't like complications and settings...)

05-03-2006, 03:43 PM
Hehe. We'd have to add the 'Please, I'm sorry I fiddled with it - can I have some reasonable settings back' button.

Aged P
05-03-2006, 06:08 PM
Hi Pentool,

The blotches were cause by the procedure that it took to get the thin coat.
Which was, too erase a pinhole down to the canvas.
From what Andy said, I think this tells ArtRage that it is a tiny area of canvas and that everything else is a bump. But he has gone away to think about paint thickness, so all these complications may become redundant.

I went to a local class and saw a real Bob Ross painting, we will never be able to entirely simulate the paint thickness. The trees and mountains are 3D due to the thick paint.

The palette knife was once destined to be able to pick up paint, I shall start nagging about that now! I've been trying a thin roll of tube paint and then knifing it about, but the paint keeps regenerating instead of scraping off.

I have been part of the Beta testing and have banged the Bob Ross drum since the start. I still use his DVD for reminding myself of his techniques.

05-12-2006, 11:01 PM
As you know, it was the Ross style that I first applied to ArtRage, it worked very well for "mousing" paintings. I had never thought about importing a white or black image to get the "liquid". Great idea for those of us who like this technique.

Aged P
05-13-2006, 12:04 AM
Hi Cym,

Just importing a black image gives a layer of paint about an 1/8th thick.
It's more like sculpting soot or flour.

This way, there's a very, very thin layer of paint.
Now all we need is a virtual finger tip to test it.

Import one of these, dab in a few vivid colours and then use Enchanter's tip of using the Palette Knife with 0% pressure

More fun than a pocket full of squirrels!

Aged P
05-15-2006, 05:13 AM
This combines The 0% Palette Knife, a new wet canvas which I will also post, and a blob of yellow brush paint. Absolutely nothing else.
If you make the paint too chunky it doesn't work.

The new Rich Brown Wet is large, about A4 size and probably won't show up immediately.

If you're a Bob Ross fan this is as close as ArtRage gets to a thin coat of wet paint. Import the .png image file and start painting.

If anybody wants a particular size black or white then let me know and I will post it. I know that ArtRage should be able to stretch anything it to any shape, but sometimes it struggles.

05-28-2006, 06:32 AM
I have tried the black background.
It make a real difference.
How have you pepared this background?
I have made a black jpg for comparing and there was
almost no changing.


Aged P
05-28-2006, 08:07 AM
Hi Johan,

The giver of wisdom at Ambient, the mighty Andy solved it!

Get any colour you like as a .jpg. Black, White, Graduated blue.

Then follow these steps.

1. Import the .jpg into ArtRage.

2. Drill a tiny hole through the very thick paint with the Eraser set to about 1%, plus maximum pressure and softness, best done in a corner.

3. Use the paper settings, right hand side of bottom menu, to reduce the opacity to zero.

4... Export it as a .png

When you import it again there will be a very thin film of paint.

I have tried to get Ambient to make a "finger print tool" to check the thickness, as mentioned in the BR video. :lol: :lol:

05-28-2006, 02:07 PM
Yes "Wet on Wet" must have that... i used to get up very early in the morning hours just to record Bob Ross... always admired his oil techniques...... :)

05-28-2006, 08:01 PM

I have tried with a blue gradient.
It opens a lot of posebilities.


Aged P
05-28-2006, 08:16 PM
Hi Johan,

I've got all the real world Bob Ross kit and did a local BR painting course.
Wet into Wet, is clearly not just a Bob Ross technique. The big problem with transferring the style to ArtRage is the paint. ArtRage is the most realistic oil paint in the world, but Bob Ross paint is different, more like toothpaste in consistency.

He did keep saying that you couldn't do his style without his paint.
This was not just a way to make you buy his paint rather than another brand. Bob Ross paint is different. You can't do his style perfectly without it. But with the ArtRage tools you can get pretty close!
.................................................. ............................................

I just photographed this BR pic, I did it at a BR class.
I've now totally repainted everything but the mountains.
Using Grains and Chalk is better than the corner of a BR brush for doing leaves. The Airbrush sorts out the water and reflections. The Palette knife just doesn't have the control to do mountains, so these are still the chunky ones done with the real equipment.

Aged P
07-11-2006, 08:45 AM
Just a blank to get my edit into view

07-11-2006, 09:07 AM
that is a cool crispy scene !

Move over Bob Ross! :wink:

Aged P
07-11-2006, 09:15 AM
I will take that remark kindly Enchanter, despite the fact that he's been dead since 1995! :lol: :lol:

07-11-2006, 10:45 AM
My god, has it been that long? I remember learning of his passing. It was very sad. I frequently spoke of his demeanour in jest, but I used to love catching his programme on TV.

Anyway. Didn't mean to derail the thread. That's a beautiful painting, Aged P.


07-12-2006, 02:20 AM
The painting is just beautiful.


07-12-2006, 06:18 AM
same here, I love it !

07-12-2006, 08:56 AM
Nice Aged P!

Aged P
07-14-2006, 04:34 AM
The last scanned in Bob Ross painting that I have.
When there are are no mountains, Artrage does it better.

This was a pretty boring picture, but it was useful to do a total rework as practice.
Working through the trees with varying Grain size and tone was easy and very enjoyable. the sky got toned down to a softer blue as well.

To make it work you have to process the imported pic to provide a thin paint layer.

07-14-2006, 06:51 PM
It's lovely!


07-16-2006, 12:11 PM
thats an amazing picture, gorgeous!

Bob Ross dead.... :oops: ...I didnt actually start watching his programmes until a few years ago...I didnt realise!

08-11-2006, 07:08 PM
Thankyou so much,

I was using a hit or miss method b4. Schmearing on a color, then running the pallette knife over it, and smoothing it out, but like I said, it was very hit or miss.

Personally I can use wet into wet for portraits, water, fur, heck, a whole lot of different uses. There's this one project on the Yarnell Fine Arts Workshop that this is perfect for. It's a lake scene with swans. Start with liquid white, and keep adding colors, in increasing intensity. Water looks amazing. Now to test it in ArtRage.

Ooh and monochromes will work up lots faster too! Now I'm giddy :D.