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Sketchism71
08-06-2009, 04:29 PM
The most difficult adjustment for me with digital art has been making it seem as "real" as my traditional art. When I finish a traditional art project my house smells of toxic chemicals, there is a huge mess to clean up and I've usually ruined at least one nice shirt. However, I usually have something ready to hang on a wall and make this world at least one painting more interesting. With digital, 99% of my art exists in a little manilla file folder on my desktop.

I'm not sure if a thread like this already exists here or not, however I thought there needed to be a place to show off some of the completed, printed, and displayed artwork of ArtRage.

This can also be a place to discuss the in's and out's of the printing, framing, and displaying process.

To date, I have had only one project printed. I had it done through Costco on standard poster paper (pretty inexpensive). It was more or less to get a feel for the printing process and to see how well the resolution, size, colors, and values worked with an inexpensive printing.

I apologize if a thread such as this already exists (I was unable to find one).

So here we go... Let's see it ArtRagers!

Silentman
08-06-2009, 04:36 PM
That looks great Sketch, what a great idea, i'd love to see some of the printing results and to get a good handle on the printing pro's and con's :)

wenkat
08-06-2009, 08:48 PM
Let's see how it turns out! I am also eager to know about the printing ventures of ArtRagers here.

Flynn_the_Cat
08-07-2009, 12:10 AM
Got a bunch of posters printed - no nice pictures, just the attached, but they looked fantastic :D

And
http://fc01.deviantart.com/fs46/i/2009/204/d/5/Postcards_by_Flynn_the_cat.jpg
http://flynn-the-cat.deviantart.com/art/Postcards-130562623

http://fc06.deviantart.com/fs46/i/2009/204/9/3/Shades_of_Grey__final_by_Flynn_the_cat.jpghttp://flynn-the-cat.deviantart.com/art/Shades-of-Grey-final-130563030

Sketchism71
08-07-2009, 03:06 AM
Wow... Those are awesome Flynn! Do you do your own printing?

Lima
08-07-2009, 10:30 AM
Sketch, cool avatar. I agree with Wenkat "I am also eager to know about the printing ventures of ArtRagers here".

Silentman
08-07-2009, 10:41 AM
Are you kidding me Flyn those are excellent, thanks for sharing.

Folks if you post your pictures that you have had printed can you please explain the process and what ever setting are relevant to the printing, the technique and the place you had them printed with or at please, i like others really want to learn the best techniques for printing them :D

foxytocin
08-07-2009, 11:46 AM
Well said, Silentman....
Sketch, this is a wonderful thread to start and I look forward to see it progress....

Madge
08-10-2009, 09:18 PM
A great thread and some lovely artwork too - it's nice to see how work looks when it's framed up and out there!

For my own home use I print my digital stuff on my Canon Pixma printer - the inks are archival and if you print high res images on high quality papers it gives an excellent finish. I've had some on my walls at least two years now with no loss of colour - obviously out of direct sunlight. So, unless you need larger sizes or are selling your work I think quality inkjet printers do the job.

My husband makes some of my frames. I like chunky, modern frames and the example in my photo is done in sycamore. I also buy up cheap ready-mades when I see some I like and then tailor-make my art to fit, rather than create some art and then try to find a frame!

The example is an ArtRage painting of a cupcake - if you hadn't guessed.Sorry about my hand reflected in the glass. ;)

Just as an afterthought, it sits on a picture shelf (not shown)that my husband put up. If you haven't seen one, it's a great way of displaying framed artwork. No nails in the wall and you can swap them around and change them whenever the mood takes. You simply put a groove in the shelf as you would to display plates. :)

Raybrite
08-10-2009, 09:25 PM
They should make a room freshener with the smell of the art studio after a painting for when we finish one.
Nice paintings.:):):):)

Sketchism71
08-10-2009, 10:30 PM
Looks great Madge! That's a great idea with the frames...design the art to fit the frame. Could save a lot of money in the long run buying frames in advance that are on sale! Thanks for the post!;)

Flynn_the_Cat
08-10-2009, 11:09 PM
They should make a room freshener with the smell of the art studio after a painting for when we finish one.
Nice paintings.:):):):)


ugh, no thanks - the smell of paint makes me ill.


Re: printing. I didn't do it - i gave my stuff to a local printer, and sold the above (some of it, anyway *sad* ) at a local art convention.

What I had to be sure of:
dpi (300 or more)
size - this particular printer wanted each file to be EXACTLY right (eg, a6 size for postcards, a5 etc - minus 5mm for trimming. )
- be aware of whether you want a border or fullbleed, as you can lose stuff around the edges

Colour! this was a big one. Firstly you don't know until it prints EXACTLY what it will be like. Secondly, if you can get at Photoshop (i used a friend's) or something else (what?) that can convert to CYMK (ink colours) from RGB (all possible colours - computer default) then do it. Most of mine where fine, but there were a few colours - the sky in this picture (http://flynn-the-cat.deviantart.com/art/Ice-Within-107839588), for example - that need extra inks, so only very professional/expensive places (eg Redbubble) will print it properly (I bought some cards from them ^_^ )



Also, paper type (plain paper? what can the printer handle eg ink or laser) gsm (210 is thin card, 100 is thin paper, 250 is thick card etc)

Silentman
08-11-2009, 10:19 AM
Thanks heaps Madge great to know that an ink jet will do a nice job, the cup cake looks great :)

Excellent Flynn, was hoping you would come back with some more info :D

byroncallas
08-11-2009, 11:18 AM
Great idea Sketch. Love the looks of that baseball over the fireplace.

While I'm not an expert on the subject, I have just enough knowledge to do serious damage. :D I've printed a number of my ArtRage paintings and plan to print many more. When I free up some time I'll participate more in this thread. I have a keen interest in the experience of others using modern printing processes, and especially with blowing up AR file exports to expanded dimensions.

As a quickie, I've always printed my ArtRage paintings on canvas at a commercial copy center using large six-color HP Inkjet Plotters. The plotter can handle items up to around 44 inches wide and any length. It's quite decent quality but will never compare to the professional results obtainable with giclee printing (also an inkjet process, but it actually prints real texture that matches your original). Processes like giclee can produce astounding reproductions, often looking unexpectedly better than your digital file.

The most important thing to remember is that no printing process will ever match your digital file perfectly. There will always be differences that you may prefer or hate. The art of printing your paintings (when reproduction fidelity is a serious issue) is learning how to work with your printer to make judgment calls for varying color and tone that provides you with an artistically acceptable result that can be obtained with the processes and equipment being employed. Physics matters. If you want the best possible results with low print runs, use giclee processes. For mass print production, offset lithography is still the best way to go, but I don't think that's the discussion here.

When engaging the printing process with high-fidelity in mind, it's important to put on your "mature" hat and work cooperatively with qualified printers to collaboratively produce satisfying results. Anything else is a recipe for frayed nerves and murder.

If all you care is to print out small paintings to size from your AR files, often getting your prints at Costco or Sam's etc. is more than satisfactory even as it is imperfect. What's acceptable to you is what matters. If you want fine-art results where fidelity is critical, work with professionals and get educated about the strengths, weaknesses and limitations about various printing processes. If you simply can't be bothered with all that, but still want good results, find a good printer you trust, trust them, and let them do the best that they can, which is often a heck of a lot. Listen to them. If they need something from you, give it to them.

If you plan to blow up your paintings large, professional re-sampling software, like Photozoom3 (software types that either you or your printers use) is a must. Blowing up your artwork with dimensions that substantially exceed your native ArtRage files is a point of discussion for this thread. For most of us, giving the job to qualified printers is the best solution, and you get what you pay for. For those who want to be intimately involved in every step of the reproduction of their paintings in large sizes, familiarity with planning and managing massive file enlargements will pay off handsomely.

These are my quick thoughts. I hope this thread takes off. Again, I'm keenly interested in the successful experience of those who regularly blow up their paintings and how they approach getting the best results. There is so much new technology out there, I live somewhat in an older era of printing, and am keen to better understand the best that modern printing technology at affordable costs has to offer.

Sketchism71
08-11-2009, 06:37 PM
Thanks Flynn... Congratulations on the sell... It is always a bitter sweet thing to do.

Byron...Thanks for the awesome post. I knew this was traveled territory for you and was hoping you would join in and share your printing adventures with us. I to plan to have some more stuff printed and will share the results as it happens.

D Akey
08-12-2009, 02:53 AM
I used some really brushy paint thickness along with the metallic setting as a sort of faux impasto gold leaf background frame sort of thing around a spliced in photo of a guitarist for a cd cover and it looked most convincing as a painted surface.

That paint viscosity look was my big question and it read great in my context.

screenpainter
08-12-2009, 05:47 AM
wow the baseball looks awesome Sketch. good idea for a thread. Liked the cupcake too Madge... that turned out great in print.

RobertSWade
08-14-2009, 05:04 PM
Note to self ... take at least one picture tomorrow of my printed and framed works. :mad:

misterpaint
08-14-2009, 07:22 PM
Air Terminal Concept
Print on Canvas 40x60cm
78905

http://img522.imageshack.us/img522/2867/tela1.jpg

http://img522.imageshack.us/img522/2083/tela2.jpg

VARIUS WORKS:


32274

http://img268.imageshack.us/img268/7908/lavori02.jpg

Sketchism71
08-15-2009, 12:34 PM
The artwork is amazing misterpaint and the prints look fantastic. Thank you for posting them! Any hints or tips you can give for anyone wanting to print?

Hope all is well with you and again thank you for the post!:D

Aged P
08-15-2009, 05:54 PM
Hi Guys,

One annoying downside to a good printer.:)

I had an old HP printer which would turn out acceptable prints. I now have a new Epson which is more modern and infinitely better.
But!

It is so good that it shows up all my errors in the paintings.:o

My personal perception is that paintings done with the ArtRage lighting switched off look more like the original when printed.

It's something I have banged on about for several years.

ArtRage has a virtual light source in the top left area of the canvas. It makes paint look shiny and 3D. That light will often make no sense when the picture is placed on a wall. It is , of course, fabulous on screen!

Therefore I often paint with the virtual light switched off and use traditional techniques to give three dimensional effects. The light is then where I imagine, and decide, it will be. When exposed to typical room light the printed painting is still defined by the light that I painted.
If it were possible for me to light each print, from roughly the same assumed point that ArtRage provides, then I would do that and leave the inbuilt lighting on.

To me it then looks better when printed, but it's a very subjective thing.

I suspect that to get it more "right" I need a "screen spider" to synch the colour of the screen and the printer.

Phil

(When we've resolved this one we can move on to the simpler question of "What is ART?":))

Sketchism71
08-15-2009, 07:08 PM
Interesting point Aged P! I never really thought about that. For the paint textures to appear realistic on the screen, they would need a light source. I assume this only effects paint that appears raised of the canvas? I also assume that some of the preset canvas textures utilize this light source as well? How is it turned off?

Aged P
08-15-2009, 07:53 PM
Hi Sketch,

Hit F5.

It gives you, in some ways, a more realistic painting experience, but not for chunky oils.

It reminds me of Acrylics with a lot of water.

Phil

byroncallas
08-16-2009, 04:42 AM
Phil is on to something I think for many flat paintings. However, with highly textured paintings like mine, turning off the lighting effects makes the painting unrecognizable. This is one of those things you just have to test with your paintings and files. A cheap way is export a file both ways (lighting on and off) and print out on the home inkjet printer or for a couple of bucks at a local copy center and get an idea which direction to go before a larger printing on canvas.

For paintings like mine the test isn't required. It is obvious as soon as you turn of lighting. But for other paintings with more subtle or no texture, it's worth the experiment to find out. :)

Sketchism71
08-17-2009, 04:45 AM
Thanks Phil, I messed around with the light function on a few of my finished AR projects and it appears to be very very subtle. To the point that I wasn't sure if the F5 function was working or not. I wonder if it is because of the style of the majority of my paintings. Most of my work is done with the crayon tool and with paper roughness setting set to 0%. Very flat and all texture effect is "painted" not dependent on the raised (3D) effect of some of the paint in the AR program.

Byron, I tried your experiment on my home HP inkjet and did not notice a huge difference (again that may be just the style of my paintings). I did however, notice that the printed images printed VERY VERY dark (independent of the light setting on or off). What is the deal with that??? So, obviously, since we are looking at an image on an illuminated canvas (the illumination of the monitor) are the actual images going to be darker once printed on a non-illuminated surface? With a photo... well a photo is what it is once downloaded to the computer (from a non-photogragher's stand point at least) but a painting is built from the ground up and I choose my values based on the image that I'm seeing on my monitor. I would paint in lighter values if I knew my images would look this dark on paper. Or... is it a printer issue... Hahaha...This rabbit hole is leading to a can of worms!

Anyway... I ordered a couple prints of "Misty Morning" through Costco (which uses a Canadian company called PNI Digital Media to print larger format prints. I ordered 2 20 X 30" prints on "Lustre" finish paper. Very cheap, $8.99 each with about a $5 shipping and handling fee.

Resolution and size is a whole different issue but I will explain how I handled that. My original painting in AR was painted on 11 X 17" at 200 dpi. I exported a PNG file (photoshop opened it 30 something by 40 something at 72 dpi???). I changed the dpi back to original and the size readjusted. I was lucky, the 11 X 17" multiplied up to 20 X 30 pefectly so very little cropping was needed. FYI, Costco did not accept TIF format but did accept a PNG format. I then downloaded the cropped PNG file to Costco and BAM! Done! I will let everyone know what they look like in a week or so. Sorry about all the info but I hope it helps anyone that may be trying to also figure out this process.

RobertSWade
08-17-2009, 06:25 AM
This is the wall behind my recliner. :)

Sketchism71
08-17-2009, 06:31 AM
Fantastic Robert! However, I would have to turn that recliner around so that it becomes the wall "in front" of my recliner!:D Beautiful paintings!

RobertSWade
08-17-2009, 06:38 AM
The "wall" in front of my recliner is a 52" LCD TV. :D

byroncallas
08-17-2009, 08:19 AM
Sketch, you're in the printing soup now.:D:D:D

Yes, if your digital painting has no "bump" texture you won't see much difference with lighting effects turned off. (In AR the bump texture tools are the oil brush, tube paint, and glitter, especially tube paint and glitter used to get all that fabbo texture in a lot of AR paintings.) Turn off lighting on my paintings - they are different paintings.

(Attached is a work in progress with lighting effects on and off. The difference is immediate) (By the way, stand 8 feet or so from your monitor to get the right visual effect of this painting - it's designed to be seen from a distance.)

The "bump effects" in AR are not possible to render with lighting off. It's the technology that makes AR special. You can test yourself. In AR put some thick glitter, some oil paint brush paint, and a few strips of tube paint. Turn off lighting and the substantial difference is obvious.

The test for your own painting is simply toggle F5 and review the results, export a file in both modes, and perform a home printer test to see if one is preferable. If it looks good on the monitor with the effects off, there isn't any way to know for sure, without testing, which mode is right for you.

I'm not surprised your printing output was darker. Brand this in the brain: If fidelity to your source is your printing goal, adjustments to the file and/or printer are required depending on the printing methods and substrates used. I'll get more to that further down.

It is not a good idea to paint your painting lighter or darker on your monitor to compensate for your printer results. That significantly complicates matters. It's impossible for you to guess if the WRONG COLORS AND LIGHT you are painting on your monitor will come out as the RIGHT COLORS AND LIGHT when printed - humanly impossible, a recipe for disaster..

Calibrating your monitor for RGB is a good step (I think Juz might be a good source for input on how). But frankly, you work with your monitor every day. You want settings where things simply look good, not too dark and not too bright, when you surf the web, look at photographs, etc. If you ever get two separate monitors to look exactly alike you aren't mortal. As a minimum step, adjust your monitor to look visually pleasing when you search the web. Go to sites that have a lot of art, both the old masters and modern painters, and see if your settings on average look good. It's not at all a perfect approach, but it gets you in the right direction. The monitor looks different depending on the light, if it's day or night, etc. Do the test out of any bright light. All of this is why calibration to RGB output is superior, though I've not done it with my own monitors. I will though, since I will be printing more and more of my paintings. The machine is more accurate than your eye. and everybody sees differently in different light settings.

So, back to that dark printing. For your home printer, you have two choices, or both choices working together. First is to adjust your home-printer output settings to increase brightness and contrast, and gamma if your printer has such settings. It's adjust and test, adjust and test. Secondly, with third-party software, adjust your file for brightness, contrast and gamma. It may look terrible on your monitor but improved in the printout. Again, test. There is no other way. Change your home printer and you'll need to change your settings. This horrid fact can not be escaped. The marriage of the digital file to the plethora of printing devices is wildly complex. When fidelity matters, somebody somewhere has to make equipment and program setting adjustments to bridge the gap, and use the human eye to make a judgment call on the final result.

Commercial printers deal with this day in and day out. Most commercial printers have to first convert your file from RGB to CMYK. Immediately differences emerge. CMYK has a narrower range of color it can reproduce than does RGB on your monitor. If you have lot of RGB colors in your painting that are outside the CYMK gamut, you will have color shifts in your printed output. (Juz is an expert on this - I think she gave you a pallet with RGB colors that are all within CYMK gamut. If you don't stray with too much brightening them up you'll get better results from your commercial printer). Your commercial printer is always making adjustments to your file to try to get a pleasing output given his printing equipment and your choice of substrates. He is doing this without you knowing about it. It's part of his job.

Now, here comes the rub when fidelity matters. For the printer to near match what you want, he has to have something to look at to make a comparison. He needs a visual target for comparing his output. (In commercial offset printing they additionally use a machine called a densitometer to make certain measurements that say if they hit it or not. Those measurements are contract standards for the print run).

The printer's job is to keep making adjustments to both print-equipment and file settings until achieving the best possible result. A good printer knows when he can't get closer. He will advise on adjustments to help you achieve something acceptable. If you can't reach a print-goal agreement and you believe another printer can, change printers. A smart client understands these limitations and works cooperatively with the printer to get something good. A bad client is one who pushes for what can't be done; those clients should be shot. :) A bad printer is one who makes no effort to help you achieve a satisfactory result and clearly is not competent manipulating his equipment and your files. You might shoot him.

But back to the rub. What is the printer going to look at to help him make decisions? For commercial business, a LOT (and I mean a hell of a lot) of money is spent preparing digital proofs and press proofs that become the visual guide (and contract) for the printer to achieve his results. YOU CAN'T AFFORD IT.

So what to do. Some simple things can help. Go to a copy shop and have them run several small ink jet and/or laser printouts that are lighter and darker (brightness and contrast) until you have a printout that is in the direction of what you want. Have them adjust color as needed, giving them clear direction on what to heighten, lesson, etc. until you get something that gets you in your target direction. Do this at home if your home printer is flexible enough.

THIS IS NOT PERFECT by any means, but it provides a directional, visual reference so your printer has a concrete starting point. If your laptop monitor provides a good approximation, take it with you and show them that too. Provide anything that gives them something they can see so they can be matching their output to an agreed source. Without a visual it is all language to describe the near indescribable given the depth and breadth of visual nuance in any painting, especially nuance in paintings like yours.

I don't have big bucks for digital proofing and press proofing. So I get inexpensive proofing at a local copy shop, the same guy who will use his six-color HP Plotter to print my stuff out on canvas, and we work inexpensively to get a directional proof that guides him. (As an aside, when my printer is looking at HIS monitor with my files, what he sees looks nothing like what comes out of his printer. He has to play the same guesswork game as you do with your home printer. Usually this is all going on in the background without the customer having a clue.)

In the end, I'm standing there with the printer while he runs his own print tests. I provide him with guidance; likewise he provides me with guidance on what he can achieve, which helps me and him come to a decision for the final output. I get a good result, always with divergence from my original vision, but beautiful nonetheless, sometimes maybe even better than my original thoughts.

This all sounds complicated, but it doesn't have to be. Good commercial printers have to deal with these complexities all the time. A competent commercial printer can achieve quite good results quickly if you provide them with decent input and a clean file. With most representational art they can look at your file and get a reasonable idea of what you intended and hit something pleasing. (With abstract art like mine, they might not have a clue :))

For dimensional blowups and increased resolution of AR files I like to resample up my files with Photozoom3. A good printer can do all of that for you, you just have to pay. (Be advised the re-sampling algorithm in AR when resampling up can considerably alter the painting depending on its content. Compare versions if you use it. Third party software designed for this purpose is preferable.) Most people should just leave it to the printer, being sure to ask them to provide a proof sample for any work that will be expensive. Their final proofs become the target reference and contract.

I can't stress enough the importance of proofing when you are being picky about the results. If you have leeway, good printing resources, especially the better giclee printers in the business of printing fine-art paintings, will do 95% of the work for you. When engaging these printers, listen to them, and give them what they ask for to help them get you the result you want. Let them do their job.

Again, I want to emphasize all this is only for those with a critical need for specific fidelity. It's way overboard for the majority who just want an acceptable even if low fidelity printout they can get for a few bucks at Costco or on their home printer with a little diddling.

This is a lot and I haven't had time to edit it down. I hope it isn't overwhelming and will be useful. It probably raises questions, so do ask. :)

byroncallas
08-17-2009, 08:32 AM
This is the wall behind my recliner. :)

Robert, I LOVE your wall. :):):):):)

These are printed to the AR canvas size, no significant blow-ups - you probably had little or no problem getting acceptable results would be my guess?????

Aged P
08-17-2009, 08:41 AM
1) Has anybody ever synched there colour between the screen and the printer with one of the special tools that are available? They compare the printer out put colours and the screen. You stick them on the screen like a three legged spider.

2) When you've done all the tinkering that you can and things seem great, don't then buy a different brand of ink!

Lastly,
I have just used up my first set of Epson inks and switched to a set that were 1/4 the price.

The printouts have lost the red cast and now look better!

I think that chance is as big a factor as skill.

Printing is a minefield whether you do it yourself or pay someone else.

My best results are now done using HP paper in an Epson printer equipped with cheap and cheerful ink!

Phil

UK members might like to try this! It would result in a Printed Painting with the light coming through it, the ultimate fusion.:)
http://www.creativelydifferentblinds.com/

byroncallas
08-17-2009, 09:15 AM
Phil's post says a few powerful points in a few words.

Printing is particularly a minefield when the client's demand for a so-called perfect result is inconsistent with the laws of physics and chemistry, an all too common occurrence. The result is enormous amounts of wasted time and money to try to achieve something only one person in the world out of 9 billion will notice.

In an earlier incarnation (much earlier) I spent nine years representing clients on press with commercial printers to achieve contract printing goals. The art is the management of the complex mechanics, physics, and chemistry of printing to minimize (but never eliminate) the random effects of chance and gravity to achieve an affordable acceptable result. Achievable and affordable married to acceptable are the operative words. And in the context of working with competent professionals, common sense is the guiding light.

Strangely, with clients common sense is often the first victim, quickly followed by a dwindling bank account. :D

Sketchism71
08-17-2009, 09:48 AM
Byron... I owe you more for that response than I do Costco for the prints I just ordered! Wow... A lot of information that is still processing in my VRAM (Very Random and Aging Memory). I will defenitly also look in to calabrating my monitor. I see there are a few different ways to do that. This is a good link if anyone is interested http://www.drycreekphoto.com/Learn/monitor_calibration.htm
(http://www.drycreekphoto.com/Learn/monitor_calibration.htm)
I have some friends that own a fairly large company who's product is taking and printing photos of youth sports. They have a huge printing lab that is capable of the larger format and canvas prints but I've not yet picked their brains about all this. Maybe my next printing will be with them in a more intimate setting where I can dive in and see all this at the working level. Right now, with my limited knowledge of the printing industry, it is difficult to comprehend.

As far as the Costco prints, hopefully they will turn out acceptable. I'm not that picky because they are just for personal use and they were pretty inexpensive. I think I will just be happy to see it in large format and not on a monitor. In the future, I will be interested in more expensive higher quality images but I feel I need some printing mileage and knowledge before I dive into that. Thanks for an awesome response! Yes, I can absolutely see the difference in the light function with your paintings...Yikes!

Phil - My sister is a graphic designer and she has one of those monitor spider things... I should ask her about it.

Thanks for some great posts... This is exactly what I was hoping this thread would turn into!:D

byroncallas
08-17-2009, 11:22 AM
Thanks Sketch. The link you provided for calibration is a good one. It's been sitting on my desktop for a couple of months while I get around to ordering their simple tools. It should be sufficient for most of us. If Juz ever buzzes over here I'd be interested in her thoughts on monitor calibration.

By all means pick the brains of your friends and go to their plant and have them walk you through their process. That kind of experience can't be beat.

Yes, when you get your prints (and if they are acceptable) it's thrilling seeing your paintings in larger formats, off the monitor, and up on our walls. It's the full realization of all your work. It's a shame so many of these things stay locked up in a digital file on a hard drive somewhere and don't make it out and up on a wall where they they can be more fully appreciated. Paintings like your "Before the Storm" are so much more emotionally satisfying at say 4x3 feet, etc. That's when they can really take your breath away.

Later Mr. Sketch,
Byron:)

RobertSWade
08-17-2009, 02:59 PM
Thanks Byron. Those were all printed at home. The ones I sell I send off to www.pixeloutpost.com (http://www.pixeloutpost.com) to be printed as giclees. They do an admirable job of fine tuning the colors.

byroncallas
08-17-2009, 03:41 PM
Thanks Byron. Those were all printed at home. The ones I sell I send off to www.pixeloutpost.com (http://www.pixeloutpost.com) to be printed as giclees. They do an admirable job of fine tuning the colors.

Sketch - there you are; Robert said everything I said but in one sentence. Use a really good giclee printer. :)

Silentman
08-17-2009, 03:55 PM
Whats happened to Juzzy, i haven't seen her post for a couple of weeks now, has anyone heard from her :( ??

byroncallas
08-18-2009, 05:17 PM
Whats happened to Juzzy, i haven't seen her post for a couple of weeks now, has anyone heard from her :( ??


Good question Silentman. I've wondered the same; I've missed her.

Aged P
08-18-2009, 06:15 PM
Hi Guys,

Even Professional Printers can be suspect!

Many, many, many years ago I used to help out in my uncle's print shop. Treadling the Arab printer which had a beautiful stallion embossed on it, or trying to keep the Heidleberg on tune. It was a two man outfit plus me occasionally. After a while it became obvious that i could mix ink colours better than the partner. After a little longer it became obvious that he was genuinely "Colour Blind"! It was all downhill after that!:)

Phil

byroncallas
08-18-2009, 06:29 PM
A good one Phil. And not all that uncommon. With printers, ya gotta do yer homework. But once you have a good one you're usually fine for a while. :):);)

byroncallas
08-18-2009, 08:50 PM
Sketch (and all): Turtleman has started a similar thread at http://www2.ambientdesign.com/forums/newreply.php?do=newreply&noquote=1&p=207665. I've suggested he pop over here to share his expertise. Meanwhile, you may also find his thread a useful resource.

Sketchism71
08-22-2009, 10:13 AM
Thanks Byron! Here is Misty Morning framed. This is the cheap print ordered from Costco. I thought it actually came out pretty nice (better than expected actually). I threw it in a frame I already had. The size of this print is 20 x 30". I would actually like it in a nicer frame with matting...but at least you guy's can see how the print turned out!

byroncallas
08-22-2009, 11:21 AM
Terrific Sketch. Yes, it came out quite nice - good light, lots of atmosphere and the detail and color subtlety in His Majesty are all quite fine. Not bad at all. 20 x 30 is a pretty nice size for getting a better feel for the work. Congratulations.

Which process did you use at Costco, and what did they charge you. Maybe you could post some of your printing specifics as useful input for others. Orderly information for people would include (and anything you don't know just say "I don't know.").

1. What was the pixel size the file you gave the printer.
2. What was your final print size.
3. What was the printing dpi (or was it a continuous tone photographic reproduction.
4. Do you know of anything specific the printer did with your file before printing (like color correction, re-sampling up, etc.) or did you just give it to him and pretty much took care of everything like magic without your involvement).
5. Did you see a color proof before printing? If yes, did the final match the proof (good/bad/etc??)
6. What process was used for printing (four or six color ink jet, laser printing, offset lithography (not in this case), photographic process reproduction, giclee, etc.)
7. What was the printing substrate: glossy or matte paper or card stock; canvas and what kind; photographic reproduction stock; etc.
8.. What is you honest opinion of the result? What's better than you expected? What's worse? Are you satisfied with the outcome?
9. What did it cost?
10.What did you learn?
11. Would you use the process again for work you are going to hang on your wall? For selling to clients?
12. Do you have any recommendations that come from your experience?

If everyone posted even half of this stuff it would give others a more realistic experience about what to expect. Since the thread is intended as a resource, it would be great if you found a few minutes to kick it off. (How's THAT for putting you on the spot - see, your friends can be jerks after all :D:D:D).

Again, congrats Sketch. Looks great from where I sit. I bet it will look splendid in your home.

Byron:):):)

Silentman
08-22-2009, 12:37 PM
That looks awesome Sketch, i wouldn't change a thing, i wouldn't even change the frame :)

Sketchism71
08-22-2009, 04:59 PM
Thanks Byron, Thanks Silentman!

Dear Byron, I function best under extreme pressure!:D I will gather up the answers to those questions to the best of my ability and post them. I am at work right now so I don't have access to my files. I will let you know soon! Thanks for the comments "Jerk":D:D! lol...kidding of course!

Alexandra
08-22-2009, 09:17 PM
Sketch, your paintings are magnificent! Thanks for the wealth of information. :)

sandyg
08-23-2009, 08:53 AM
Sketch your Bear is gorgeous and he looks lovely in his frame. The printout
looks really good, what a lovely size.

Sketchism71
08-23-2009, 04:09 PM
Alexandra, and Sandy... Thank you!:)

byroncallas
08-23-2009, 07:25 PM
Sketch, since you function better under pressure, we'll just have to get out the whip. :eek:.

From your favorite Jerk: :D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

;)

Ole Seegelken
08-25-2009, 08:48 AM
Printed on a Epson Stylus Pro on Canvas. Size is 200cm x 100cm

I find the color reproduction really satisfying on the Epson Printer.

[ATTACH]32342[/ATTACH

screenpainter
08-25-2009, 10:33 AM
Ole what a great piece for your wall. The color fidelity looks great on the Epson!

byroncallas
08-25-2009, 01:28 PM
Fantastic Ole. looks like a fine printing.

If you don't mind me asking, were were the print dimensions and resolution of your original exported AR file; and what was the dpI for the Espon printing?

:):)
Best, Byron

Sketchism71
08-25-2009, 04:31 PM
Terrific Sketch. Yes, it came out quite nice - good light, lots of atmosphere and the detail and color subtlety in His Majesty are all quite fine. Not bad at all. 20 x 30 is a pretty nice size for getting a better feel for the work. Congratulations.

Which process did you use at Costco, and what did they charge you. Maybe you could post some of your printing specifics as useful input for others. Orderly information for people would include (and anything you don't know just say "I don't know.").

1. What was the pixel size the file you gave the printer.
2. What was your final print size.
3. What was the printing dpi (or was it a continuous tone photographic reproduction.
4. Do you know of anything specific the printer did with your file before printing (like color correction, re-sampling up, etc.) or did you just give it to him and pretty much took care of everything like magic without your involvement).
5. Did you see a color proof before printing? If yes, did the final match the proof (good/bad/etc??)
6. What process was used for printing (four or six color ink jet, laser printing, offset lithography (not in this case), photographic process reproduction, giclee, etc.)
7. What was the printing substrate: glossy or matte paper or card stock; canvas and what kind; photographic reproduction stock; etc.
8.. What is you honest opinion of the result? What's better than you expected? What's worse? Are you satisfied with the outcome?
9. What did it cost?
10.What did you learn?
11. Would you use the process again for work you are going to hang on your wall? For selling to clients?
12. Do you have any recommendations that come from your experience?

If everyone posted even half of this stuff it would give others a more realistic experience about what to expect. Since the thread is intended as a resource, it would be great if you found a few minutes to kick it off. (How's THAT for putting you on the spot - see, your friends can be jerks after all :D:D:D).

Again, congrats Sketch. Looks great from where I sit. I bet it will look splendid in your home.

Byron:):):)

First off, Ole, your painting looks AWESOME! Nice splash of color and it really stands out in that room! :D

Ok Byron, let me see if I can tackle some of your questions;

1. The final pixel size of the image that was uploaded to Costco's photo web site was 4500 x 3026 at 150 dpi (ppi). That was not what I painted it at. I painted it at 17" x 11" at 200 dpi. I used photoshop to crop and resize it to the above pixel and dpi. That pixel size equaled 30" x 20" which is the largest size Costco offers as a print.

2. The final print size was 20" x 30" (4500 x 3026) at 150 dpi. I sized it to the exact size because I wasn't sure how they would do it if I sent them a size that did not match their standard 30 x 20 print size.

3. I'm not sure what the final DPI was it was printed at. I don't know if they just printed the image I sent or adjusted it somehow.

4. When uploading a file to Costco, there is a selection you can choose to either have them color correct (among other things) or not. I chose the "not" selection. I wanted it left alone just to see how it turned out as a raw image from AR. No adjustments were done by me or them as far as I know.

5. I did not see a color proof per se, however it did give me a print preview to show if any cropping would occur to have it fit the size of the print.

6. I have no idea what process was used for printing. Might be able to find out somewhere buried in their websit but again, this is a seperate company that contracts out to Costco so information about the actual printing process might be found at the company that actually did it. (PNI Digital Media).

7. Not really sure the substrate but the choice was poster size and a choice of gloss or lustre. I chose lustre.

8. My honest opinion of the result is "Better than expected" especially for the money. $8.99 per print. It looks awesome framed and I am very pleased with it. However, it seems a bit thin and fragile and I notice at certain angles, I can still see waves in it from it being rolled up in the tube it was shipped in. That also may be my poor framing ability!:D

9. Well I learned this is a reliable company with a decent product and very fast service. It was easy and you really didn't have to do much other than upload the file. VERY EASY.

10. I will defenitly use them again if for anything the ease and the cost effectiveness. I am happy with it and I would be happy "giving" these prints as framed gifts or something but probably not on a professional level. Although that would all depend on what a client wanted. If they wanted a poster to tac up in their garage while they are working on their car...this would be fine (lol). If it was going to be hung in the entry way of the White House... I probably wouldn't use Costco! (lol)

My recomendations would be to try it if you are curious to the results because the process is fairly simple and the product very reasonably priced. A much worth it experiment.

Hope that covered most of it. Let me know if I didn't answer something correctly. You can put the whip away now:D:D

byroncallas
08-25-2009, 05:04 PM
Hey Sketch, excellent. If a few more people follow your lead and post their experience it will make this thread a useful place for lots of people looking for advice on printing their paintings. You get the "following instructions" award of the week. Rosy is wrapping it up to send too you as I type. :):):):):):)

That rolling thing you see is typical, especially once the "poster" has been rolled. It often gets worse over time. It's usually best to mount the poster on art or poster board. For this type of printing those artist's spray adhesives will do, just do it outside so you don't die from the fumes. Then frame it again with good pressure from the frames backing board. It WILL look better.

Ah, I gotta run. Rosy's looking for postage.

:):):):):):):):):D:D:D:D:D

Silentman
08-25-2009, 05:14 PM
Good to see 150 DPI did just fine as i was saying :)

Ole Seegelken
08-25-2009, 11:14 PM
Fantastic Ole. looks like a fine printing.

If you don't mind me asking, were were the print dimensions and resolution of your original exported AR file; and what was the dpI for the Espon printing?

:):)
Best, Byron

Hi Byron, thanx for your kind words!

The original output file was 7000x4000 px.

I often start with lower resolutions ( here with 3500x2000 px) because of the better responsiveness and better workflow on my imac 24". When I like the Painting i change the resolution and work on details...

I don´t know if the printshop scales the resolution further... (i think so)

byroncallas
08-26-2009, 07:08 AM
Thanks Ole. That's helpful.
You must have quite a bit of RAM. My measly 3GB chokes up in AR with a painting that large, 3500 X 2000 px).
Thanks again. :)

shatzy
09-25-2009, 07:56 PM
My 1st painting with artrage :)
Printed on real canvas (20x30cm)
is a gift from Stefano (misterpaint)


http://img85.imageshack.us/img85/4954/telavincenzalato.jpg

http://img182.imageshack.us/img182/4645/telavincenzaretro.jpg

http://img24.imageshack.us/img24/3170/telavincenzafronte.jpg

Silentman
09-25-2009, 08:12 PM
WoW !! shatzy that's awesome, can we see the spec for that one, it's brilliant :D

Very inspiring Stefano, what was the resolution and everything, who printed it, if possible how much did it all cost, omit the last part as i see it's a gift :)

shatzy
09-25-2009, 08:35 PM
:p thx!


20x30cm 150dpi of resolution

real canvas
Italian painting canvas guaranteed
Frame in plywood
Print high-quality paints with natural pigments


Misterpaint printing on www.fotoregali.com (http://www.fotoregali.com) € 26.00 (for printing)+ € 6.90 (for shipping).
For shipping around the world if I remember correctly ... 16 Euro.

dali
09-25-2009, 08:57 PM
Wow, these are all great. I have had so much trouble with printers. I used to print them out on my own home printer, but the colors were always horrid. I was always tweaking, using up ink, paper, and still never getting it right.

I tried a local printer in town, and had 100 postcards made of two different pictures. One had a lot of green in it, one had a lot of pink in it. When I went back to get them it was awful. The pinks looked neon as did the greens. I told him I just couldn't send out postcards to editors and art directors looking like that and he began to explain that he was going to stop taking orders from artists because they were just too color picky. Well duh! I'd like it to actually look like what I had intended for it. I decided I would never go back to him.

Another time I had some printed at a FedEx printing place. I needed some portfolio pics for a conference. I was careful to print out on a thick paper and then picked two pics from the batch I was having trouble adjusting on my home printer. I then waited there while they printed out the samples. Way, way too dark. He lightened by 15% and printed out again, and it was near perfect. So now I know that most of them will need to be lightened to look like what I have on my monitor. (I had even transferred them all to CMYK before taking them to FedEx.)
(I was printing out 8 x 10 at 300 dpi.)

Another question, what is this spider thingy you all speak of, and where can I get one. ;)

Silentman
09-25-2009, 09:07 PM
Great, thanks for the details Shatzy :)

Sketchism71
09-26-2009, 02:35 AM
Shatzy, that turned out beautiful! :eek::eek::eek:! I love the look of the canvas prints but they seem a bit pricey especially to have done at that size. Regardless, your painting turned out marvelous.

Rick
09-26-2009, 05:52 AM
Dali, I just went to your gallery.. If I could paint like that I would want to make doubly sure prints were exactly perfect, just as I have painted and viewed on my monitor..
You do such very nice work..

dali
09-26-2009, 09:26 AM
Thanks Rick, your gallery is equally impressive.

But yes, I wish the colors would turn out right when the files head off to the printer. I had a dummybook printed out on lulu for one of the children's books that I wrote, and it came back a little less than what I was hoping for. On the whole, it wasn't bad, price was okay as well. ($11 for a 32 page full colored book) You can't tweak colors after you send them though. You just have to hope that it will look right when you get it back. As it is, I am going to have to redo and reprint if I want to send them out to any editors. I actually did print out a 'photo' book with lulu using some of my art, a little more expensive (about $50 for 30 pages) but the colors turned out a lot better for some reason.

Sketchism71
09-26-2009, 12:52 PM
I totally agree with Rick, Dali. To answere your question about the monitor spyder here is a link to a photo of it ... http://spyder.datacolor.com/images/photo_s2e1_500.jpg

Im sure there are many different products out there but this will give you an idea of what we are talking about. :):)

Aged P
09-26-2009, 05:11 PM
Hi Sketch,

As I entered the Forum, with this still sizzling on the Clip Board, i read your post.:) Prices and a review here too.

http://www.warehouseexpress.com/buy-colorvision-spyder-2-express/p1012615?utm_source=WEX063&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=colorvision-spyder-2-express&cm_mmc=email-_-wex063-_-product-_-colorvision%20spyder%202%20express

Phil

Aged P
09-26-2009, 05:21 PM
My new Epson printer was not living up to expectations, fantastic photos but lousy paintings.

I got a considerable improvement when I found the "Automatic Photo Enhance" button and turned it off.

It stopped Sharpening my deliberately hazy areas, stopped winding the Contrast up or down and left the Colour Levels alone.

Phil

Aged P
09-28-2009, 10:57 PM
Hi,

I've spoken with Costco UK, because they come up so many times on this thread.

They were really helpful.

The people who do their printing are actually.....

http://www2.catchincolour.co.uk/

If you sign up with Costco, as a Business, there is a 25% discount on Catchincolour's prices. But you have to pay £20+ a year to join Costco.

Phil

Sketchism71
09-30-2009, 05:37 AM
Thanks Phil for checking that out about Costco. The Costco here in the U.S. uses a different company for the prints and it doesn't look like you can do any individual business with this company. It seems as though you have to buy through Costco. That's O.K. though, where else can you buy 150 roles of toilet paper all at once and nobody looks at you funny....LOL!:D

fraser_paice
09-30-2009, 06:02 AM
A word of warning, when I had this one framed they asked if I wanted it under glass but the printers had claimed the ink was fast for a hundred years etc, so I didn't... So while I was decorating I put it in the shed, covered in paper. A slug or snail got under the paper and it's trail has lifted the ink, they are water based inks. You can see the discolouration at the base of the tree on the right, I'm thinking of trying to touch it up with water colour paint.

Next one is going to be under glass or varnished!

screenpainter
09-30-2009, 07:10 AM
That looks great Neil. (Even signed by sluggo the slug. wow. collectible. )
But seriously, it looks beautiful.

Sketchism71
10-03-2009, 04:41 AM
Neil, I remember that painting and it is one of my favorites. The print looks great! Great lighting! Was the service a bit sluggish? I assume you used snail mail...lol! Thanks for posting!:D

Below is the Birthday Invitation I did for my son. Might clean it up a little and add a few more bells and whistles to it. Printed on my home ink jet. Turned out pretty nice (I thought it would print a lot darker but it wasn't to bad.

coops
10-03-2009, 05:08 AM
Thats turned out great Sketch, bet all the children will love it:)

byroncallas
10-03-2009, 09:08 AM
I've been away from this thread for a while. Lots of cool updates.:)

Regarding Monitor Calibration, there are excellent reviews on the Spider 3 device at: http://www.northlight-images.co.uk/reviews/profiling/spyder3elite.html

You might find these reviews helpful.

I am ordering the Spider 3 Elite, with fingers crossed.

Other links in the site will take you to reviews of other Spider versions. For my purposes I like the Elite since it has multi-monitor calibration capabilities.

I would suggest not getting the older Spider 2, which I understand is good, but less reliable.

Cheers all,
Byron

EDIT: The Spider 3 Elite turned out to be a great device. Pretty darn good.

screenpainter
10-03-2009, 09:39 AM
Sketch that turned out fantastic!

byroncallas
10-03-2009, 10:16 AM
Sketch - I love the poster. Terrific. Great fun. Looks like it printed GREAT.

Neil - your painting looks handsome there on your wall. I get some of my stuff printed at a local shop on canvas with the big six-color HP plotters. Those inks are water-soluble and must always go under glass or be spray varnished. They are certainly not archival inks, which I think will be true with any of these low-cost ink-jet printings (I'm presuming yours was an ink-jet process(?))

Sketchism71
10-03-2009, 02:14 PM
Thank you Albert!:D

Byron, you found yet another can of worms in this bucket of snakes of a thread...lol:D So if I have my images printed on canvas they should still be framed behind glass? If that is true, I would have never of guessed that! Hmmm. How do you know if ink is archival or safe?

As little as I know about printing, I know even less about ink.

...and thanks for the comment!:D:D

byroncallas
10-03-2009, 02:59 PM
Thank you Albert!:D

Byron, you found yet another can of worms in this bucket of snakes of a thread...lol:D So if I have my images printed on canvas they should still be framed behind glass? If that is true, I would have never of guessed that! Hmmm. How do you know if ink is archival or safe?

LOL Sketch. :D:D:D

A bottom line for all that follows is that printing your painting produces a fragile product that is easily damaged by light, liquids, dust and baby spit. If longevity matters, putting it under UV protected glass is your best option. You can stop here if that's all you really care to know. If you want the Encyclopedia Britannica synopsis, the following might be useful. :)

*******************
Even the best of the ink-jet and similar printing process available will not produce damage proof surfaces that come close to traditional oil paints. They are easily abrased and damaged by light, liquids, and plain old atmospheric grime and humidity.

You can easily test this. Test a sample from any printing process you are planning to use. Put water on a rag (and some other cleaning liquids) and rub lightly and see what happens. You will see different results depending on a host of variables including different inks, varnishes, and substrates. But you will see deterioration, in many instances dramatic deterioration.

The best of the offerings is Giclee. Giclee uses archival, light-fast inks. They are beautiful, stable, light-fast and last. But even with those, many artists have the printer apply a final printers varnish for protection. Why? Paintings not under glass collect dust, dirt and grime. To get it off, the paint (or ink) needs a protective surface, or must itself be insoluble to water or other cleaning solutions.

Ink deterioration from water damage is reduced in many photographic reproduction processes, but the substrate is paper which is easily damaged by liquid of any type.

Put this in context. If it's going to be hanging on a wall for many years its going to get filthy. Consider how quickly dirt builds up on your windows and mirrors. That is happening to anything hanging on your wall, including your painting. In a year a film of grime will collect. Of course, many people have no idea how filthy the paintings on their walls have become. They are surprised to see how beautiful they become when cleaned. There is an entire industry of people working in museums whose job it is to remove the grime collecting on paintings.

Test any process you are going to use to find out what would happen if you tried to clean your painting. And remember, it's not just the inks, but the substrates. Printing on paper will present different cleaning problems than printing on canvas, plastic, vinyl, metal, etc. Likewise if it's just an accident and water spills on it or a snail crawls across it or the baby spits. :D

Bottom line, all the above argues for putting anything that really matters to you under UV protected glass. We didn't really review light-fastness here, but the short version is that direct sunlight will damage your colors in short order, and ambient light will work its damage over time. UV protected glass reduces light damage, and of course, doesn't melt with the application of Windex.

The exception here may be protected giclee paintings because the printing process also prints texture. The whole point is that they look like real paintings that are not behind glass. To a large degree, putting some giclee paintings behind glass defeats the whole purpose of printing them with giclee in the first place. Nevertheless, they need to be varnished and treated carefully when cleaned, and are best hung in your cleanest rooms well out of direct sunlight.

For low volume, fine-art printing, currently giclee provides the best affordable reproduction fidelity, light-fastness and ink stability. But it's still an ink-jet process. Compared to paintings in oil, they are considerably fragile and easily damaged. Since the processes are new, they have not passed the test of time and there is debate. The industry statements often predict about 30 years of high stability and lightfastness. Protected oil paintings, on the other hand, have survived hundreds of years after considerable abuse.

The following is excerpted from ArtSales.com regarding giclee printing. It's states it all pretty well.

What is the expected life of a Giclee print?

The most important fact to remember is that all color fades. As far as fine art prints produced by Giclee are concerned, some original watercolors & most lithographs will fade faster than a well-made Giclee. Unlike lithographs and serigraphs, Giclees have undergone extensive, third-party fade-testing.
While the predicted display life depends on many variables, under typical home or office lighting , and depending on the papers used, giclees made with wide-gamut pigmented inks are estimated to last 35-100 years without noticeable fade. These estimates are based on laboratory simulations of aging. All of our testing information comes from independent testing labs and the manufacturers of the materials we use. artsales.com shall not be responsible for any damage to our prints from improper handling or from exposure to extreme environmental conditions.

Do Giclee prints require special care?


We recommend that you treat your art prints produced by Giclee the same as other original limited edition prints. It should be protected from water and should not be placed in direct sunlight. Giclees printed on paper should be frame mounted behind glass or, if on Arches paper, may be mounted on a panel and varnished. Giclees printed on canvas are treated with an acrylic varnish to aid in their protection, however careful treatment is still desirable.

Considering that Giclee, the most advanced of the ink-jet process available, requires such delicate handling, it becomes obvious that everything below it requires even greater attention to safe handling and protection from the environment.
:
The discussion above doesn't consider offset lithography, since it's a volume printing process. Fantastically permanent inks and varnishes can be applied. But the printing is usually on paper-based substrates harmed by liquids. Consequently, paintings printed with offset lithography process are usually put under glass even though the inks may have a high degree of permanence.

Sketchism71
10-05-2009, 04:14 AM
Wow Byron, you are an endless resource of information in this subject... I think I will go sit at the little kids table now! LOL:D

This is all very interesting and what a great response... Thank you. I'm sure many here (including me) will find that extremely helpful!:)

ddemetrius456
10-07-2009, 01:10 AM
WOW… lovely sketch! Very interesting and great response... Nice try 2 tell evreybody. Thanks for sharing a wonderful post. :)

Lima
10-08-2009, 01:24 PM
Sketch:eek::eek::eek:

Byron thanks. Very valuable contribution.:cool:

Silentman
10-14-2009, 12:12 PM
Just bumping this thread up the line as a few people were looking for it :)

I honestly think this thread should be stickied because nearly every member asks at one stage or another, how do i print artwork out of ArtRage and what settings should i use ?

Does anyone else think it should be stickied ??

Dany51
10-14-2009, 05:24 PM
As English is not my first language I have difficulties sometimes to read fast (as I like it) and I have to confess that I read only parts of texts with careful attention;
this thread is important for everybody and I thank you very much to each one who shared some of his experience.
I agree that it would be good to put in evidence this thread somehow.

The only experience that I have on printing was with my own printer (in fact I changed few , in time) , I used only the A4 size and high quality special paper,
the results was good enough but I had some paints which came out darker that I wish for it.
It was just to make a gift or to have them archived.

As I have actually very little space even my favorites oil paints and others I don't have the space to have them on the wall and don't have the envies neither, I have only one small decorative oil painting , a pastel (neither of them are by me) and a poster, all that is good enough for the moment.

I think about making a book or making high quality prints somewhere in town but I am not really enthusiast , is not the moment for me and I don't know if this moment will come, I am not a commercial person and what is not the best done I am not interested in.

I think that I already said that I developed my skills in the digital art mainly because of the lack of space and this two years I changed (like any other in here) and did my path.

I really don't know what tomorrow would be , I am interested in content not in fashion but I really would like to make something more material in good quality and have people who are able to appreciate it.
Doing prints for myself I don't find it so interesting
but I would like to find out more about printing on canvas and painting on top of it.
I know that on this forum are also many painters, do any of you experienced this technique ?
I will be glad if any of you can share his experience on that subject.

The point is that I like to work on good quality linen canvas and I am not sure that is possible to find that when printing.
So, have, a nice day everyone and the best for your work.

Sketchism71
10-14-2009, 06:27 PM
Great idea Silentman... I've had to go dig for this thread a few times and I agree, there is a ton of information here that could be a great resource for others.:)

Great comment Dany! I myself have not explored canvas printing yet. You have a great idea with painting on a printed canvas and mixing the two media...Very cool! Hopefully someone chimes in on this, I would be curious as well.:)

Dany51
10-14-2009, 07:30 PM
Thank you Sketch, You are very kind but is not an original idea,
people are already working like that,
of course, what is good is less often known :)

misterpaint
12-30-2009, 09:36 AM
My first cover for an Italian Publisher.

38811

38812

BOOK TITLE: Discussioni con un Gargoyle
Autore: Marcello Nardo
Publisher: http://www.ilrovescioeditore.com

here the work in progress :)
http://www2.ambientdesign.com/forums/showthread.php?t=22789

hola!

Sketchism71
12-30-2009, 10:44 AM
That is fantastic Misterpaint! Congratulations to you!:D:D:D The cover looks awesome!

Silentman
12-30-2009, 12:10 PM
Congrats Mr Stencil Stickers and awesome achievement to be sure :D :D

Borilius
12-30-2009, 01:04 PM
I have a lot of AR paintings printed, but at the moment they are all part of an exhibition around the country. Once they are back, i'll put them here :)

byroncallas
12-30-2009, 01:13 PM
My first cover for an Italian Publisher.


Hi-five Stefano. Congratulations. I like that smile on your face, enthused with your new accomplishment. Great guns and great going. The work is beautiful - you've every reason to smile from ear to ear. :):):):):):)

screenpainter
12-30-2009, 04:26 PM
congrats Stephano on this beautiful cover... great work.
also Borillius your work is amazing on your site... we will wait patiently for the
return of your artwork... congratulations on the tour.

Eileen724
12-31-2009, 03:26 AM
Wow....what an informative thread, that's for sure! I do believe that this should be a "sticky" so it doesn't get lost in the back of this gallery! It might even be classified for the "Tips and Tricks" gallery - as a sticky of course!!!

I've been wondering what others are doing with their completed works with ArtRage and what it would entail for me to print any that I would like to have done. This is definitely a keeper and one for others to contribute their finished works and printing info!!!!

misterpaint
02-01-2010, 02:34 AM
Fauno

Print on canvas A4.
This is an experiment.... I have printed with my "EpsonStylys D68 Photo Edition" on canvas (canvas for inkjet), A4 format.... and glued on a frame (with canvas) preexisting.

http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/2519/faunocompleted.jpg

My materials:

1) Inkjet Canvas Sheets: http://www.artsuppliesuk.co.uk/product_info.php/products_id/154

2) New Blank canvas:
http://www.3ggorla.it/tele_maxi_0000.jpg

3) Universal Glue:
http://www.comparestoreprices.co.uk/images/uh/uhu-power-adhesive-33ml-blister-pack-ref-43911.jpg

D Akey
02-01-2010, 03:30 AM
Fauno

Print on canvas A4.
This is an experiment.... I have printed with my "EpsonStylys D68 Photo Edition" on canvas (canvas for inkjet), A4 format.... and glued on a frame (with canvas) preexisting.

http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/2519/faunocompleted.jpg



Vedo quello che hai fatto, ma non so se si sente l'esperimento ha funzionato. E 'difficile dire dalle immagini di piccole dimensioni. Qual è stata la tua impressione di incollaggio tela a tela, se ho ben capito.

-----------------------------
I see what you did, but I don't know whether you feel your experiment worked. It's difficulty to tell from the small pictures. What was your impression of gluing canvas to canvas, if I understand you.

misterpaint
02-01-2010, 04:54 AM
My impression is great :D

40928

narf
02-02-2010, 03:29 AM
Fauno

Print on canvas A4.
This is an experiment.... I have printed with my "EpsonStylys D68 Photo Edition" on canvas (canvas for inkjet), A4 format.... and glued on a frame (with canvas) preexisting.

3) Universal Glue:
http://www.comparestoreprices.co.uk/images/uh/uhu-power-adhesive-33ml-blister-pack-ref-43911.jpg



How about using wallpaper paste? It can can be put on the surface rather plane, by using a paint roller or large brush.

Wallpaper paste is a quite traditional glue especially made for large paper formats.
Normal other glues can contain chemicals which might destroy the paper after a while.

Here I found a tutorial how to make canvas print with an ordinary inkjet printer.

http://forum.penum.de/showthread.php?id=51719

Unfortunatly it is only German.

The guy bought a cheap canvas, removed it of the woodframe and glued it with
week gluing removable glue on a strong paper sheet. Then he let his printer do the job,
removed the print from the paper sheet und put it back on the wood frame of the canvas.

Happy testing! ;-)

By the way - I am looking for an inkjet paper what has a light brownish color (not too yellow,
more ockre with a touch of umbra). Canson is tooo yellow. I need something
like that http://www.photoshop.de/pics/buettenpapier.jpg as special paper for inkjets.
Normal handmade-paper makes the inkjet color to bleed into the paper. :(

I want to print in a vintage-like style. The pictures shall look 100 years old. :)

Regards.

Sketchism71
02-02-2010, 11:51 AM
This is excellent Misterpaint! I didn't know small inkjet printers were capable of this! Thanks for sharing it. The result from the pic looks awesome!

misterpaint
02-02-2010, 12:47 PM
>> Thx Narf for the links ;) very kind.

>> Sketchism71 thank you, I'm testing many ways to exhibit their work independently ;)

another example
(in this example I used the picture of my tutorial http://www2.ambientdesign.com/forums/showthread.php?t=24902 )

http://img686.imageshack.us/img686/6982/vicoloromano2.jpg

Detail:

http://img13.imageshack.us/img13/4545/vicoloromano3.jpg

..... example:

http://img222.imageshack.us/img222/7560/esperimentotela23.jpg

Awakenedart
03-03-2010, 02:12 PM
I thought I would share this. This is my first artrage painting. I am still getting used to the control of a tablet and trying to rediscover my talent for art. I am also trying to find the secret to scaling/printing/dpi and what my computer can handle (currently upgrading to try and handle the max artrage can deliver)

Anyhow, this was done at about 11x20, at 100 dpi. I then scaled it up to 26x38, not changing the dpi (which i will try here soon) and then had it printed off again on a 13x19.

All in all it came out well, there is a little difference in quality, but its not major.

This is just printed on heavy card stock, maybe 200#, from my local printshop.

Sketchism71
03-03-2010, 03:56 PM
Excellent painting and the prints look like they turned out very nice. It is always difficult to know 100% from photos of them but they look nice. Good to know also that they turned out even with the dpi at 100. Thanks for sharing them and I'm glad you found this thread!

Awakenedart
03-04-2010, 07:56 AM
My printshop prints them at a minimum of 600dpi, so with this at 100dpi its probably similar to an HD tv smoothing out a standard definition channel. At least that thats the way I think about it.

byroncallas
03-04-2010, 09:15 AM
My printshop prints them at a minimum of 600dpi, so with this at 100dpi its probably similar to an HD tv smoothing out a standard definition channel. At least that thats the way I think about it.

Terrific prints. To your 100/600 dpi point, in a way it's a fair analogy "in fact". The difference,however, would be one of both intent and the viewing environment. There can be intentionality in the 100 dpi print, or, it may be all that's needed depending on the piece of art itself, the distance from which it will be viewed, etc.

In some cases, 600dpi may smooth out an image in undesirable ways depending a host of factors in the painting itself, the printing substrate, the viewing distance, etc. These are factors that complicate the options available to the artist and the choices she might make.

While the HD analogy is an accurate one, unlike when watching a movie where HD is most of the time going to be the more desirable choice, it may not be the case in when printing a painting. While there are generalities that suggest in most cases 150 to 300 dpi is a good bet, at the end of the day, it's case specific. :)

JonHodgson
03-04-2010, 11:42 PM
Heh heh here's a quick webcam snap of me with one of a limited edition I did of ten big prints of "mountain boy" (A painting I posted here: http://www2.ambientdesign.com/forums/showpost.php?p=209407&postcount=47). I've used this painting in particular to dispel the myth that ArtRage can't make big images for commercial print:

Flynn_the_Cat
03-04-2010, 11:50 PM
I've used this painting in particular to dispel the myth that ArtRage can't make big images for commercial print:

...heh. Sometime I must photograph the a2 posters I made :D

byroncallas
03-05-2010, 03:53 AM
Heh heh here's a quick webcam snap of me with one of a limited edition I did of ten big prints of "mountain boy" (A painting I posted here: http://www2.ambientdesign.com/forums/showpost.php?p=209407&postcount=47). I've used this painting in particular to dispel the myth that ArtRage can't make big images for commercial print:

Wonderful Jon. Terrific painting and a good one to demonstrate your point.

Perhaps to help everyone out you could describe a little how you got your result. Something along the lines of:
1. print size setting and dpi while painting it in ArtRage
2. stats on the exported file used for printing (its file type and properties)
3. any adjustments to the file either you or your printer made to prepare it for final print production and its final file properties.
4. Your final print specs and print methods including method (for example, 6 color-inkjet on a plotter, or giclee, or other), print dpi, and printing substrate.

However little or a lot you had to do, I think people would be appreciative to know your particular solution. It appears wonderfully successful. :):):)

Awakenedart
03-05-2010, 04:40 AM
"Perhaps to help everyone out you could describe a little how you got your result."

I second this.

JonHodgson
03-05-2010, 05:05 AM
No problem. So, when I mention I talk about this image to people who doubt that you can work big in ArtRage, I'm referring really to the size of the digital image rather than the print. I've spoken to a few commercial illustrators who have heard you can't work at print res in AR and maintain a practical workflow. Completely untrue.

This one is 9000 pixels wide - which means I can print from it at 300dpi and get a 30 inch (762mm) wide image. Even at 200 you'll still get a pretty good quality print, which could therefore be upto 60 inches wide. Not sure where I'd hang one of those though.

I work as an illustrator, so I'm set up with a pretty powerful computer - though these days pretty much anything you spend a bit of money on will have sufficient specs. I'm using an imac with a dual 3.06 GHz processor, and 4 Gig of RAM. Really, (and as a generalisation) it's the RAM that lets you handle large files.

I exported the image as a PSD, which I do all the time, once I'm absolutely certain I'm done in Artrage. Of course, once you "Export" you lose any Artrage specific functions like paper grain and reworkable, "interactive" paint and so on. You just have a regular graphics file the same as any other. I find PSD to be a very stable format suited to what I do.

I do use Photoshop to adjust my tonal levels, and I will confess up front I have not investigated what AR can offer on this front - Photoshop is my weapon of choice for that, and hard to beat as a wildly expensive, state of the art image editing tool. To allow it's impasto to work Artrage seems to lose a little in the darker tonal areas, so I beef those up in PS.

The printers I use generally print things a little darker than I would here at home, so I adjust my tonals levels accordingly in photoshop, just lightening up the mid tones using the layers pane in most cases.

For my printer I then save the image as a zero compression jpeg. The larger the better - so in this case I didn't reduce the file at all.

The substrate for this one is nice heavy 240gsm HP paper, and it's printed by Poster XXL in Germany: http://www.posterxxl.co.uk/ I've found them to provide an excellent service, and to be honest I get them to print pretty much everything I do to sell - they have a better selection of papers and sizes than I can keep here in the studio at home, and though I only go to a couple of trade fairs a year to sell prints I was finding the time it took to make up a decent selection of prints, combined with the cost of ink these days made getting someone else to do it, and paying them, was highly competitive.

Hope that helps!

byroncallas
03-05-2010, 07:37 AM
Jon, thanks, much appreciated. I'm surprised you are able to work fluidly in AR with such a large file. With my 3gb of ram and dual core processor (and my experience seems to be not unusual) a 9000 pixel wide file pretty much shuts AR down after throwing in a few layers. Throw in something like the paint brush and AR is is dead in the water for me.

If you have a secret for getting a computer at 3gb to dance well with AR you will make lots of people rather happy. Thousands of users have computers with 32 bit Windows OS whether XP, Vista or 7. If I understand correctly, 3gb is the max working RAM in that configuration (yes? no? Maybe?).

Any enlightenment here, including your 4gb experience with the super-duper handling capabilities may give a lot of people some additional direction toward working with AR more robustly.

Thanks again. :):)

Dany51
03-05-2010, 08:49 AM
Jon thank you to share your experience, I didn't find yet the printing system for me and i will perhaps give a try to this one.

Your image is excellent as I see it in the file, perhaps you don't have many problems with the file manipulation because you don't have many colors in it.
Do you send your images on CD or directly upload them,
I saw there are a limit of 20Mb and you speak about huge file if I understand well ?

Also, how about the shipping service , is it prompt,
how long it takes from the upload to the receiving the print ?

Thanks again !:):):)

JonHodgson
03-05-2010, 10:32 AM
Ok, check out size reduction of files when saved as jpeg. Even on zero compression. It's quite a huge reduction. There's nothing to be gained in sending in files larger than the required physical size at 300dpi, so there was some reduction there in this case if I recall correctly.

Generally I paint "a la prima" digitally, so I don't use layers for any length of time. That really helps keep file sizes manageable. Not much help if you want to use several though I realise!

Regretfully I can't really help much to figure out how to do big files on a particular spec machine, or even a PC. I've invested in the best Macs I can afford for ten years or so, as a necessity for my job, so I'm a bit limited in my experience there! Keeping layers to a minimum I have already mentioned, but yup, each individual machine will give up at a certain point, so you have to work within sensible limits that are right for your hardware.

I print all kinds of images, and am extremely happy with the colour repro. So it's not to do with colours, or lack there of, in a given file. I'll pull out some more brightly coloured ones tomorrow to show. :)

Delivery from Posterxxl is a very good question. At checkout they say prints are despatched within... Now I can't remember off the top of my head how soon, but that is slightly misleading, since it usually takes ten working days or so. Which is fine once you know and can plan accordingly.

Something that works undeniably in my favour, but sounds a bit pompous, is years of experience working in digital paint for print reproduction. That's something that is hard to impart in a few sentences, but generally you can't just paint anything and expect it to print well. Screens of course make colours very differently to inks, and working within the printable range of colour and tone is something that takes practice. And that final stage of adjustment in PS. Really saturated colour will usually fall out of "gamut": strong screen reds, cyans and greens can all pose problems for reproduction in ink. Making things a little lighter, a little less saturated, boosting tonal contrasts where necessary... All that stuff really helps get a good result.

Of course you also need to know your monitor is well calibrated too, and I've already typed too much on this tiny iPod keyboard!

Again, I hope there's some useful info in there somewhere! Adjusting digital images for faithful reproduction is a major skill set in itself.

misterpaint
03-23-2010, 11:10 PM
thx Jon!! :D great info!

Dany51
03-24-2010, 03:58 AM
Delivery from Posterxxl is a very good question. At checkout they say prints are despatched within... Now I can't remember off the top of my head how soon, but that is slightly misleading, since it usually takes ten working days or so. Which is fine once you know and can plan accordingly.

Something that works undeniably in my favour, but sounds a bit pompous, is years of experience working in digital paint for print reproduction. That's something that is hard to impart in a few sentences, but generally you can't just paint anything and expect it to print well. Screens of course make colours very differently to inks, and working within the printable range of colour and tone is something that takes practice. And that final stage of adjustment in PS. Really saturated colour will usually fall out of "gamut": strong screen reds, cyans and greens can all pose problems for reproduction in ink. Making things a little lighter, a little less saturated, boosting tonal contrasts where necessary... All that stuff really helps get a good result.

Of course you also need to know your monitor is well calibrated too, and I've already typed too much on this tiny iPod keyboard!

Again, I hope there's some useful info in there somewhere! Adjusting digital images for faithful reproduction is a major skill set in itself.

Thank you Jon, yes is good to know what to expect as delivery time
and then we are not astonished ,
no doubt the most important is the quality of the print and also if is not too expensive .

I like to work with contrast but I am sure it will be alright about that and I have some documentation about calibration and all that have to be done
before printing,
I think that the enormous amount of images created, printed, painted
give me some idea about being very prudent on multiplicity but still,
at a certain point, I have to do as any other do, no more no less .:):):)

Sketchism71
12-17-2010, 05:26 PM
Thank you everyone for all the info that has been shared in this thread. It has been extremely helpful.

This is the final printing of my Christmas card for 2010. I had them printed through Costco and they turned out pretty good. I had a test photo printed first (glad I did) and it was a lot darker than the image on my screen (the original png file). I had to lighten the image in Photoshop to get the desired look on the final printing. All in all I am satisfied with it and thought I would share it in this thread.

Thanks for checking it out. Merry Christmas / Happy Holiday's!

Eddie

byroncallas
12-17-2010, 05:57 PM
Eddie, they are BEAUTIFUL. :)

screenpainter
12-17-2010, 11:46 PM
yes Eddie those turned out beautiful. hats off to Costco and your adjustments in photoshop. :)

justjean
12-18-2010, 03:19 AM
Hi All, some awesome paintings in this thread :)

Just thought I would drop a couple in here, printed on my Canon Pixma 6600, I bought a pkg. of Hahnemuhle Digital Fine Art Collection papers, it had an assortment of different surfaces, The OES was painted with Painter and printed on the Fine Art Canvas paper and the xmas one (just a cut out of my buddy with a christmas hat painted on :D) was done on some prefolded cards that I bought. I have also printed things out on watercolour paper and they turned out fine :)

Sketchism71
12-19-2010, 11:49 AM
Byron and Albert, thanks a bunch! Much appreciated. Justjean, those paintings turned out fantastic!:eek::)

Aged P
12-24-2010, 02:07 AM
Hi Eddie,

It is the time of year, again, when you should be awarded "A Major Prize!"
Clear a space in the window for it. :)

Merry Christmas to you and your family.

Phil

Sketchism71
12-25-2010, 09:04 AM
Thanks Phil! Merry Christmas to you as well!!!

P.S. My oldest son is actually getting a BB gun this year (not a Red Ryder though...hahaha):D

conrad
02-10-2011, 03:58 AM
Hi, everyone
was looking at this thread on printing and was wondering if anyone has printed to canvas. If yes how did it turn out. I am using ArtRage Studio Pro on a MacBook Pro Love the program just would like to show my work at a professional level. If anyone could help that would be great.

suziQ54241
02-10-2011, 04:05 AM
I've had 3 Artrage painting printed professionally by canvas on demand. And they're incredibly wonderful. Pricey, but wait for a groupon. And all I've printed on paper or watercolor paper made for my Epson look smashing as well. I mat and frame them.

conrad
02-10-2011, 04:20 AM
Susan,
Did you have a canvas setting as you painted or did you keep it smooth and let the real canvas take care of that look?

hanzz
02-10-2011, 04:57 AM
I print very regularly a canvas on commission. Mostly for a surprise at a party.
A retirement, a birthday, you name it.
I often ask the clients to send me a picture of those people with their canvas, but only once got a picture back. I do get mails that praise and thank me for the work I do, but most forget on the evening itself, to shoot them. (shoot a picture, I mean !)

byroncallas
02-10-2011, 05:20 AM
Just following up on Susan's note, printing your paintings out on canvas can make a wonderful difference. I've done several tests printing the same painting on canvas vs. other substrates, usually paper. In almost all cases canvas produces a superior "painterly" look.

Drawings often look better on paper, and some illustrations that are more of a "poster" orientation will look better on paper. And sometimes vinyls used for store displays and billboards produce cool looks. But for "paintings", canvas is really the way to go.

Giclee printing processes will almost always produce superior prints. However, I've gotten some great results going down to the corner copy shop and printing with large four or six color plotters at little expense. It depends a LOT on your subject matter how those may come out. I do a lot of abstract art which is, usually, more forgiving than a fine portrait where your color and other subtleties may have little room for variance from your ideal. So if you can, go Giclee on canvas, though as Susan points out, it ain't cheap.

A final note about canvas settings: Any affect of a canvas setting in your file image will show up in the printing. And of course, the canvas you use to print on will have visible affects in your final printed image. The room for experimentation and variance is large. So it's good to think about the paint program canvas settings and the printing canvas if you are being particular about the final product.

It's hard to make a recommendation and say do x with the digital canvas settings and y with the printing canvas without first knowing what kind of result you are looking for. What is important to know is that both make a difference, so factor both in your intentions for you final product. Frankly it is rather fun to experiment. :)

Hanzz: That is COOL.

MJSparks
02-10-2011, 07:40 AM
Thanks for all the informative information. I learned a lot about printing today.

I will state totally 100% that I have little experience printing beyond my own canon mp620. It generally suits my needs well and I haven't dabbled with the settings to print out any of my AR paintings or tried professional prints yet. I am looking into it, though. I always want to research as much as I can before I venture into uncharted waters. I have a very blank wall in my living room that needs a good work of art on it. ;)

If you're going to print with a printer and you're not sure how they do things, it may benefit to ask how they handle inks.

One thing I saw mentioned only briefly was the ink. From what I've read here and a few other places. Different places use different standards for the ink, some even do their own ink mixing and refills. Which can give way to human error in colors. Especially if you get someone who doesn't follow the recipe exactly or say different employees mix inks on different days. Sometimes even following the recipe can lead to odd results in mixing inks.

Some places will even go as far to refill a cartridge that is not completely empty, so if they changed up the recipe... there's even further error in the color.

So, the point is to be sure if you're not using some place that's really awesome fancy... try to ask about the way they use the inks. If printing at home, stick with one brand and get new ones if you can afford it. It's worth the effort.

Again, thanks for all the information. I was suprised at the results of my monitor, it turns out it's fairly decent. :D

~Alena~
02-11-2011, 09:49 AM
I use not modern computer and, for today, absolutely weak videocard
Intel Pentium4 800 MHz / 2.8 GHz and video GeForce4Ti 128MB
Only 1GB RAM and Windows XP 32Bit.
Nevertheless, usually, my drawings in ArtRage - width/height = 5000 x 6000 pix 300dpi. 2-10 layers and final_project_file.PTG >= 250 MB.

Then export to file TIFF. 5000x6000pix_300dpi_LZWcompressed. TIFF = ~ 90MB
Which I have passed on e-mail in a workshop where print on a canvas on a stretcher. It is possible I use files-exchange service. For example rapidschare.com
The picture is made on 12-colourful printer CANON imagePROGRAF - 2400x1200 points/on inch - pigmentary ink.

Next day I take away my final picture - 40 x 50 cm. canvas on a wooden frame. I have drawn an arch specially that it replaces a baguette. So it has been planned.

After one day when the print dries up well, I put a layer of structural gel from above pictures - Universal Acrylic gel - Art Gel 3D Nerchau 100ml Crystal.
Gel does illusion of convex strokes of a paint, protects drawing from a sunlight and does a glossy surface.

PS - I am very happy with results. AfghanHound's owner has received this gift and as remains joyful. :)

(sorry web translation)

conrad
02-12-2011, 04:28 AM
anyone use a digital pad and pen when woking with ArtRage

misterpaint
05-13-2011, 09:14 AM
Ella Platon, PORTRAIT.
Commission from Romania.
I hope you like it!

30x40cm on real canvas.

http://fc08.deviantart.net/fs71/o/2010/233/5/2/52f2abfe73d24939eb7729cfc1b0d701.jpg

55791

.

misterpaint
05-26-2011, 08:37 AM
http://fc06.deviantart.net/fs71/o/2011/111/4/9/49a3862b3d67d261cabecd1fc741aca2.jpg

http://fc05.deviantart.net/fs71/o/2011/145/a/d/ad67816f1e81f0c1d8914d320c72d53d.jpg

misterpaint
05-27-2011, 06:29 AM
COMPLETED!!!!
Title: Little Japan

56210

screenpainter
05-27-2011, 08:20 PM
Stefano, all your work is gorgeous to begin with and then when printed out they look utterly fantastic. Love the colors and luminance of that baby portrait. Really amazing. Can you say how much it costs to print on canvas and tell how faithful the colors are to print directly from artrage or must they be taken to photoshop? Because these look great and seem to be WYSIWYG.
Is that your experience when printing from artrage to canvas?

misterpaint
05-27-2011, 11:55 PM
well, I explain my experience.

For digital printing, you can set your canvas a resolution of 200dpi (so it uses less RAM).
In digital usually, I try to work on 200dpi and size 1:1 (actual size). For this painting, however, I have experienced yet. 200 dpi 30x30cm (for faster execution).

In my tests, one year ago, I discovered that enlarging a drawing directly in ArtRage the loss of detail was minimal. While the enlarged picture with photoshop tended to shelling. So I painted on a 30x30 cm at 200dpi. After completing the design, I combined all levels and enlarged the canvas to 50x50cm. I just printed at this size.

The graphic studio where usually I print all my paintings, uses only ink to natural source and not to solvents. The solvents tend to saturate the colors, but with natural pigments, what you see on your monitor is very similar to the one printed. In this case 99%.

The RGB of ArtRage is very reliable
and everything is more beautiful on canvas!

screenpainter
05-28-2011, 05:25 AM
Thank you Stefano. They look very faithful to the digital ones. Well, I guess they never really stop being digital in the work flow... if you use a digital camera to take the photos as well. :) It really does look very faithful to the original images. Thanks again.

gxhpainter2
05-28-2011, 06:58 AM
Stefano - thanks for showing your printed final version....it is a masterpiece to be sure...:)

Bobbyray
05-28-2011, 09:06 AM
You are too cool Stephano...just awsome and good luck with the mission. A worthy cause for sure.;):cool:

misterpaint
06-13-2011, 04:11 AM
TITLE: GIOVANE AFRICA
Print on canvas 30x40cm

56721

screenpainter
06-13-2011, 11:46 AM
Stefano... that turned out amazing!

misterpaint
06-14-2011, 03:13 AM
thank you!!
I only bought the canvas print (glossy). I created the wooden frame. And I framed with electric stapler. All made in home :)

I have spent a total of 23 €.

misterpaint
06-20-2011, 03:44 AM
56901

56902

in this days I'm printing my paintings on canvas ... and by myself I'm applying it on a wooden frame ... it's fun!

screenpainter
04-04-2012, 11:07 AM
question for the guys?
could we sticky this thread for all the times printing questions come up?
it beats searching. :) even if we moved the thread to tips and tricks?

just had some prints shipped to me by Gary. they turned out great.
here is a link about the on one perfect resize software:

http://blog.kenkaminesky.com/onone-perfect-resize-software-review/

and if you are a student or have one living at home you can buy it here:

http://www.journeyed.com/item/onOne+Software/Perfect+Resize/1480675

screenpainter
04-26-2012, 09:36 AM
turned out great Stefano.

wouldn't this be a great thread to sticky since printing questions come up so often on the forum. :)

mitali
05-14-2012, 01:25 AM
I wanted to test out how prints would come out so tried getting a poster print. Kept the AR resolution and canvas size. No edits done in any other software. Printed posted is 18 x 24. Poster made by ShortRunPosters and I think I paid less than $15 for 3 shipped. Photo attached does not do justice to the output which looks much better when framed.

Mitali

Twaager
05-14-2012, 11:13 PM
question for the guys? could we sticky this thread for all the times printing questions come up? it beats searching. :) even if we moved the thread to tips and tricks?
just had some prints shipped to me by Gary. they turned out great. here is a link about the on one perfect resize software:

I have examined the OneOne Perfect Rezize 7 and find it good. But not the best as it comes to the resizing quality. But that is a question of taste, maybe. The OnOne software is a bit complex, but there are some good video tutorials to learn from. But Photoshop Elements 10 does a job, as good as the Perfect Rezize 7. This is my experiment and how I performed it.

I shot an image of a book on a table cloth with my handheld camera. The resolution of the image 3648 x 2736 (38,61 cm x 28,96 cm, 15,2 in x 11,4 in) at 240 dpi. That means 11,8 MB. In Photoshop I used the Camera Raw to adjust light and distortion but no sharpening. The sharpening was done after resizing. Resizing was at 260% to get the EU standard poster size 70 x 100 cm (27.6 in x 39.4 in), just like the poster in my attachment.

In Photoshop Elements 10 the resizing was carried out by using the Nearest Neighbor algoritm. This gives a sharp edge. The resizing took 2 seconds. The Unsharp Masking added a slight sharpening. I used Scott Kelbys (http://scottkelby.com/)recommendations on sharpening not to oversharp or add artifacts to the photo.

In OnOne Perfect Resize 7 I carried out the resize by using the standard settings. After about 5 minutes! it was over. I used the same sharpening as in the Photoshop example. The relsult was not anyway better than that Photoshop performed. So why pay for a plugin while you can do the same work on a fraction of the time? Here are links to part of the photo for you to examine, each 12,5 x,12,5 cm (5 x 5 in).

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/4914643/Elements.jpg
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/4914643/Perfect%20Resize%207%20.jpg

If you want a poster at bigger size? Well that takes another camera than mine. Maybe Nokia 808 (http://europe.nokia.com/find-products/devices/nokia-808-pureview)? Or a Hasselblad Ferarri (http://www.hasselblad.com/ferrari-edition.aspx)?

DaveRage
05-15-2012, 02:30 PM
question for the guys?
could we sticky this thread for all the times printing questions come up?
it beats searching. :) even if we moved the thread to tips and tricks?


No problem! I've made this a sticky thread in Tips and Tricks and put a redirect in from general chat for a while to help previous posters find it.

gepocock
04-08-2013, 05:38 AM
I am also new to digital painting, and have only returned to art in the last year, having found AR3.5 - and now upgraded to t AR4. However, this week I tried to finally print something to have a 'painting' to show to reluctant family members who have said on more than one occasion, that it is not 'proper' art, as the computer does it for you! GRRR. However, I came to a big problem regarding pixels and jgep ptg etc. It seems that the images couldn't be blown up and I am still unsure of what to do net. So if anyone can help me I would be very grateful.

copespeak
04-08-2013, 10:01 AM
You really need to preset your canvas size before you begin, because enlarging it (which can be done in Art Rage) will only exaggerate the fewer pixels in your image by reducing its clarity and making it look chunky with squares everywhere.

74871

For a home print you can get away with 200dpi, but 300 is better. Professional artists can go much higher. So you determine the size of your printed work, let's say A4, then dpi at 300. Hope that helps! :)

markw
04-08-2013, 10:45 AM
Well this can be confusing and a bit complex, there are a lot of possible variables and I fear there is no one right, fits all, answer!
So consider this as just general guidance.
Also pages 22 & 23 in the AR manual have very useful information on printing, regarding things to consider before starting a painting.

The important thing is the resolution of your painting i.e pixels/dots per inch. This will determine how well it prints.
Try and get into the habit of setting up a new painting canvas each time you start a new project. Set it up using the Print Size tab, not Screen Size.
AR's default is 72 pixels/dots per inch but for printing you will probably want something around 300. At higher resolutions + a large canvas you may find AR slows a little when using large brushes and when performing internal calculations depending on how fast your computer is.

With something you've already painted you are going to have to try and upscale it by resizing. But remember when you upscale a picture you are telling the program doing it to makeup and add new pixels. At best they will be an educated guess, so don't expect miracles!
1:
Re-size it in AR by going to; Edit > Re-size Painting…
Once you have it re-sized you may well want/need to over paint/draw or replace if need be, any resulting fuzzy areas, edges and lines. This is a bit easier to do if you have used different layers for the different elements within the picture.
2:
If you have Photoshop or Photoshop Elements or something similar, you can use that to re-size and upscale your painting, after you have exported it from AR in your chosen image format, e.g .jpg.
In Photoshop (and possibly depending on version here) from the Menu Bar at the top, choose; Image > Resize > Image Resize. In the popup menu that opens check; Constrain Proportions, Re-sample Image and Scale Styles (you will need to select one to be used).

As with all things digital, work/experiment on a copy of your original file, just in case!

When you have something ready to print, ask the printer what file format they prefer to work with. But AR's .ptg format is not going to be one of them!

As to your family skeptics, get them to draw or paint something with AR. They will soon find out that it will only do what they tell it to do and nothing more. If they can't draw on paper, then they still wont be able to in AR!
Hope this is of help.

misterpaint
09-29-2014, 07:45 AM
Mini painting :) 5x5cm on forex (3mm)
83332
83335
83336

83333

83334

misterpaint
11-10-2014, 01:11 AM
84114

50x50cm italian canvas

jmac
11-10-2014, 05:41 AM
Very nice work...the mini painting you say was done "on forex"? Could you explain what forex is please?

markw
11-10-2014, 11:38 AM
Very nice work...the mini painting you say was done "on forex"? Could you explain what forex is please?

I'm guessing it was a typo.
3mm "Foamex" seems a much more likely substance for printing on.

Edit:
After some more web digging "forex" was not a typo but would seem to be another name sometimes used for foam core board. As well as "Kappa" board.

Rom__
01-16-2015, 08:30 AM
my dream - 3d printing for ArtRage Is that possible? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=owSUQ3rB-MA

lanaroady
08-29-2019, 07:45 PM
Marvellous job as the posting of that photos was not a bad idea

Caravaggio
04-23-2020, 06:59 AM
My first hour with ArtRage 6...
My first post...
My first THANK YOU, for posting beautiful ART.
I love it.

Is there gloss finish, and can you see canvas texture at some angle(s)?
Cheers,

jebbasha
10-17-2021, 08:54 AM
That looks great Sketch

Pop Alexandra
01-11-2022, 09:53 PM
That looks great Sketch

Indeed it does. One of the most beautiful works I've seen lately.